Sorry Yoshi, but if you award the best weapon in the game by winning the lottery...

[Sicno]

You may not think that, but it doesn't change the fact that people in the topic are of that level of ignorance just to prove a separate point.

...The comments you're quoting are a response to another comment with flawed logic:

Don't you think the best weapons in the game that are better than what we have now will be coming in Stormblood? My opinion you are quitting over ridiculous reason when better stuff will be released in the expansion.

And what they state on their comments are examples to show that person why that logic is flawed. It's not what they believe themselves. You have shown that you totally lack reading comprehension.



Edit: on a side note, I hate getting into these arguments where you stop talking about the topic and instead argue about people not knowing how to formulate an argument, derailing or not understanding what's actually being discussed. Discussing about discussing. Hope this is the end of it.

[Lambdafish]

Having more ways to gear up jobs is always a plus. I would be quite pleased if this was another avenue to get a top tier weapon, equivalent ilvl or otherwise. I have 14 jobs to keep up to date!

I don't think you quite read my post or understood it. I am all for more ways to gear up jobs, but you can't just throw BiS weapons into any old content, the content needs to be equivilent in the EFFORT to beat it. While I don't agree that a lottery system is the same amount of effort as savage, I will concede that the weapons are as difficult to get. I did say in my post that the diadem weapons would have been a success at i275, but the devs have not proven to me that they provide more of a progression and difficulty curve to obtain than savage or relic, that just isn't how RNG works, and putting this on the community after they have already overcome the challenges of the other two types of endgame is insulting to say the least.

To clarify even more, I agree that more ways to gear up jobs is a good thing, but balance and care must be taken, otherwise you end up with less ways to gear jobs because you invalidate and make content obsolete.

[Hyrist]

The only thing that bothers me about it personally is it seems like such a poor design decision just in like every way.

This is where we fundamentally disagree. I'd actually challenge you to do it better. Your current proposal failed the goal marker of insuring that the raid base feels a means of progression, as well as failed in properly baiting them into the content hard enough to make it worth use within the limited 3 month window.

This wasn't poorly thought out. The fact that you propose such betrays a lack of first-hand experience in development. Believe me, they're thinking about it constantly. What this was, was heavy-handed. And it's fair to be critical of that point. Calling it anything along the lines of lazy, however, makes the argument guilty of the very accusation it asserts.

Sinco, it's frustrating that you continually assert a point that is no longer valid.

Your assertion that there is a set standard for all items of value in this game is false on multiple levels. Try to follow me here, I will try to explain it again for you:

1. Items of statistical value are always on a dealthclock. (Meaning they continually degrade in value as powercreep grows)
2. Items on a time/effort value scale (your presumed Standard.) Have always had BOTH statistical value and have also had glamour value (They are unique for quite some time.)
3. Items without Statistical Value, (Glamour Items) have had crafted and/or RNG systems attached to their attainment.
4. There has never been an item of purely statistical value without Glamour Value.

Therefore, this situation has no precedent. We have an item set of no lingering value being presented to us that is of dominant demand purely statistically, which has never been done before. Therefore, there is no standard of attainment. The basis in which you apply your pattern is invalid as only half the value equation is present - and other items that have possessed the other half the the equation (and are debatable as more valuable as a result) DO have a precedent of being RNG based and relatively easy to obtain because of which.

If anything, it follows the standard of items of one value, absent of the other (Same as Glamour items, essentially.) except Glamour items have longer-lasting value. Sorry, but your particular argument just does not hold weight with me. It's logic is flawed. There are other augments here that make a better case.

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

For references sake, when I say top tier gear, I don't necessarily mean the absolute highest ilvl possible. If that was what I meant, I'd refer to it as BiS. For me, top tier gear is simply gear that is very close to, if not necessarily, the best, which in this case would be i270+. That would be why I included scrip weapons, because augmented their one of the best weapons you can have. I think some i270 are even better than their raid counterpart as well, but that's what I want to see.

[Reynhart]

However that isn't for 3 months (which in this game is a long time due to how quickly patches come out).

Alex Creator is 6 month old. That's the exact same time between each previous Alex tier. So yes, you raid weapon has a 6-month lifetime, it's not a big deal. And Anima owners can't really complain about fairness when they only had to do very casual content and were rewarded with a very good weapon at every step of the quest.

What if in 3.1 they put a weapon better than Omega1 in palace of the dead, is that acceptable now?

Yes, it is. In fact, I really hope it will be, to make something else than Omega1 a "relevant content". Put the best weapons in Deep Dungeon, Diadem and Eureka, put the best accessories in Lakshmi EX and Susanoo EX, and put the best armors in Omega. Different content for different reward.

[stanrir]

TFW the head behind the entire game is totally clueless about how stats work.

you can put what ever stats you want on the anima so you can make it your bis if you really knew what you were doing

[Welsper59]

...The comments you're quoting are a response to another comment with flawed logic:



And what they state on their comments are examples to show that person why that logic is flawed. It's not what they believe themselves. You have shown that you totally lack reading comprehension.



Edit: on a side note, I hate getting into these arguments where you stop talking about the topic and instead argue about people not knowing how to formulate an argument, derailing or not understanding what's actually being discussed. Discussing about discussing. Hope this is the end of it.

It's because you take insult from what is truly harmless. I'm going to assume that you're new to MMORPGs or the concept of progression based expansion packs. It'd honestly be the only logical way for someone to not be considered a drama queen regarding this topic. What Krokov said is, ideally, how you should be looking at the matter in this specific case. If the idea of Diadem providing the rewards it does, at the end of an expansion, is what sets you off... I'd argue you're not in the right state of mind for this topic that folks like me advocate for (your core message).

Your argument may not be about the expansion, but your feelings on the matter derive from decisions that center around the fact the expansion influenced it. Hell, I could even argue that the expansion is merely the tip of the iceberg, and that the decision was made because of the core philosophy of how they handle upgrades is in this game (i.e. part of your core message). This is not a new structure to the game. You don't have to be happy about it, but it is how it is. The more you rile up about something specific that happens, the more you lose focus on the main problem, hence why the devs won't learn. It's unfortunate, but topics like this and many of the people in it further prove how inevitable it is that things will not change for a long time. Your intent might be in the right area, but your methods/messages are not. It's like wanting to stop an ant problem by killing the ones you see, rather than going for the source.

Obviously, this means that the opposition, folks that don't see a problem at all with the current reward system, are going to be problematic to your endeavors. At that point, it comes down to whether or not the game really is for you. If you really are going to quit, then that is the right decision for you. The more expected you are to not stand your ground on what matters to you (logically speaking), the less valid your arguments are. Knee-jerk reactions to something you don't like is typical of basic illogical complaints (even if few are valid and logical). Pointing out the Diadem weapons does practically nothing for your message. It's about timing and the way you would choose to use this case to support your argument. Just because people may support your message, doesn't mean your message is as strong as you think it is, as at the end of the day, the devs are the ones who need to understand it. Clearly, they either don't or it's not a matter that goes along with what they want for the game (be it because they think/know people like how things flow now or because they are standing their ground). So again, do what is right for you.

[thegreatonemal]

snip

Your blowing this out of proportion and are being paranoid. the 280 weapon is bait on a hook, and no glamors nor anything that's not advancing your progression in some way weather that's better gear than what you have now or something that can make you a lot of money will keep people doing the content those people have already farmed it to hell and back and are prob never gonna touch it again will cause people to do this content. its balanced and weaker than the relic overall by basically being another version of mega catpot you need to win the lottery. while everything to get the relic is non rng reliant and its know exactly what you need the only two rng elements to the relic the first was nerfed and can be done in hour or so and the other doesn't stop you from progressing it it just might save you an umbrite or three at the end of that long grind you are rewarded with one of the best weapons in the game currently and might be better and in most cases is better than the raid alternative.

In short the raid weapon and relic are practical to obtain you do the thing you get the item in terms of balance they are stronger and considering you have less than 100 days to win that lottery and the fact that most people will just burn out on the content the weapon effectively doesn't exist and just serves as bait to get people to bite on the overall package of the content

[Arutan]

Don't you think the best weapons in the game that are better than what we have now will be coming in Stormblood? My opinion you are quitting over ridiculous reason when better stuff will be released in the expansion.

For god sake please stop with such garbage answer. With that logic, just say "No need to play StormBlood there will be the 5.0 with other content, better gear and new mount/minion!".

[Xerek]

you can put what ever stats you want on the anima so you can make it your bis if you really knew what you were doing

No. No you can't. Given the DPS increase on the i280s, it's almost as good as the i275 without substats at all. Then, given the i280s get about 100 more substat points then the i275s, even with a random shotgun approach almost every i280 is still going to be better then an anima, even with customized stats.