[Tanks/Healers]: Are you disappointed there is no new job in 4.0?

[ADVSS]

The fact AST was built to mimic WHM and SCH is a huge problem, IMO. To me, that's something worthy of a redesign; "Killing it" might be better than leaving it as is and trying to build off it.

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problem is they cant just kill it its too late too many people invested into it it'd cause massive blowback to just delete a job like that. I really do agree with those points, i mean they could just plop out a new healer and tank but then wed be getting a new paladin or whitemage . AST probably would have been ok with its low potencies if it were able to switch stances in combat. Still just says alot when it was designed to replace either sch or whm depending on the other healer, i mean...the switching would probably have made it play differently enough but maybe someday we can get a fresh tank and fresh healer, not designed to push x job out, etc.

[Belhi]

I think the jobs will come after not on release just like Ninja dis

They have said in the past they don't want to do that again. If they had time for that I expect they would just add an addition job to the next expansion.

[Istaru]

I am a healer main and I am 100% not disappointed. I did not want a new healing or tank class. I tank to help friends with queues at times.

WHM is my favorite healing class and even I can say it is 3rd rate for healing classes, especially for primals and savage. If you have a SCH, you want an AST. If you have an AST, you want another AST or aSCH. Adding another healer will either push out one of them like AST ultimately did to WHM, or will be another DoA job like AST was.

tl;dr Until they find a way to properly balance the healer and tank jobs so they are all wanted, I don't want anymore of them.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

problem is they cant just kill it its too late too many people invested into it it'd cause massive blowback to just delete a job like that. I really do agree with those points, i mean they could just plop out a new healer and tank but then wed be getting a new paladin or whitemage . AST probably would have been ok with its low potencies if it were able to switch stances in combat. Still just says alot when it was designed to replace either sch or whm depending on the other healer, i mean...the switching would probably have made it play differently enough but maybe someday we can get a fresh tank and fresh healer, not designed to push x job out, etc.

They did it to Bard despite the overwhelming blowback. Balance has to be rolled back or nerfed otherwise White Mage is a dead job come Stormblood. It's already fallen severely in the raid environment and will only continue to struggle unless something is done to bring down Scholar and/or Astro. At the moment, they really have nothing to add onto White Mage which will benefit a raid group more than enhanced Balance since they aren't going to take away shields from the other healers. Unfortunately, I have a feeling they are just going to give it more raw healing and that isn't going to change a thing.

[Claymore65]

Yeah, I'm definitely disappointed. I was really looking forward to a new Tank to try out, but now I won't get one.

Honestly, it's no more complicated than that. I wanted to see what new aesthetic and mechanics they were bringing to the Tanking (and Healing) roles, and the answer was nothing.

I found their excuse especially poor. Saying "you probably won't switch permanently to DPS so it'll be fine if we don't give you anything" felt like a bit of a kick in the teeth, even if I know they didn't mean it that harshly. Even their arguments about "balancing" them sound hollow, since we have no idea about how deep the changes will go. For all we know, they'll just increase potency on a few abilities for Paladin and call it done. In Heavensward, they failed to handle some of the major issues for Paladin (doubling down on Physical reduction then building raids with lots of magical damage, Divine Veil's needlessly complicated setup etc), so I have little confidence they'll suddenly become amazing. I really hope the "revamps" are excellent, but it's highly possible they'll do too little. Alternatively, the changes could be poorly thought out, and most of the Jobs become less then fun to play. "Class revamps" are not always a good thing. Even then, the "Tanks/Healers get balance" arguments equally apply to DPS. Are the other DPS classes not getting new abilities and balance updates? I'll admit, the announcement really hurt my excitement for the expansion. I wanted to see a fresh new take on the Tanking role, and I won't get one.

If their excuse had been "we could only handle two Jobs for the expansion, and we felt like we could best implement our vision of the Samurai and Red Mage as DPS", along with a mention that "Healers and Tanks will have new Jobs to look forward to in future expansions, don't you worry" I wouldn't be anywhere near as disappointed. Their excuses just felt very poor, especially since we have no real information on these supposed "balance updates" we'll be receiving. If they gave us a glimpse at some upcoming changes to Paladin, Astrologian, or White Mage, I would at least have something to be excited about. Oh well. I'm definitely disappointed, but I'll still play Stormblood, even if it does (at first glance at least) seem to have less content then Heavensward. If they don't add any new Tanks or Healers in the next expansion though...

[Claire_Pendragon]

Melee DPS didn't.
Caster DPS didn't.
They are both very different roles to a support ranged DPS.

At a stretch, your best argument here is that NIN is a melee.

"All DPS playing in the same red DPS icon = DPS fill the same role or even remotely appeal to the same audience" is an extremely closed minded way of thinking.



The difference between a PLD, DRK and WAR is negligable compared to the difference between a MCH and a DRG or MNK. Same can be said if you flipped the tank jobs with the healer jobs in that statement.

I main WAR, but I play all jobs to some level. You should too. Branch out and enjoy the other classes and be happy that we will finally have new options for caster and heavy melee.
Many people have been waiting for a new heavy melee since the release of 1.0 and we haven't got it.

Caster Tanks, Projectile/support tanks (at best WAR is a stretch for support tank)
Melee Helaers, Projectile/support Healers.

Considering tanks and healers lack the diversity DPS gained, they need it more than DPS need more diversity.
(PLD to WAR and WHM to SCH are examples of much more drastically different play styles. AST and DRK were just jobs that try to meet in the middle of the two. Only making PLD feel more like WAR, despite not being more like WAR at all. Same with AST making WHM and SCH feeling more alike, though WHM did get more instant casts)

[LineageRazor]

Overall, I'm disappointed. As others have mentioned, I'd like to have a greater variety of tanking options. DPS already have seven jobs to choose from, while healers and tanks only get three each (and one of those healers is pretty much just a DPS class with some healing abilities glued on). Tanks and healers deserve to have a variety of jobs to choose from as much as DPS do, and DPS already have a hugely diverse lineup available to them.

As for queues, that's not a big part of my disappointment, but I gotta admit that Yoshi P is crazy if he thinks this isn't going to be rough on them. While it is true that healers are likely to keep playing healing jobs, tanks are likely to keep playing tanking jobs, and DPS are likely to keep playing DPS jobs, all three of those roles are going to have a SIGNIFICANT number of people who are going to want to try out the new jobs, even if they go back to their comfortable roles later on. While queues may return to normal in the long run, in the short term they're going to be nothing short of nightmarish.

[ADVSS]

They did it to Bard despite the overwhelming blowback. Balance has to be rolled back or nerfed otherwise White Mage is a dead job come Stormblood. It's already fallen severely in the raid environment and will only continue to struggle unless something is done to bring down Scholar and/or Astro. At the moment, they really have nothing to add onto White Mage which will benefit a raid group more than enhanced Balance since they aren't going to take away shields from the other healers. Unfortunately, I have a feeling they are just going to give it more raw healing which won't continue a thing.

Yeah I was less than thrilled about some of the changes hw brought, esp to bard you make a good point. And I agree raw healing power isnt going to fix the issue, and nor would giving mnk just some more dps, unless they jacked that dps to op levels, then its not balanced yet again.

Caster Tanks, Projectile/support tanks (at best WAR is a stretch for support tank)
Melee Helaers, Projectile/support Healers.

Considering tanks and healers lack the diversity DPS gained, they need it more than DPS need more diversity.
(PLD to WAR and WHM to SCH are examples of much more drastically different play styles. AST and DRK were just jobs that try to meet in the middle of the two. Only making PLD feel more like WAR, despite not being more like WAR at all. Same with AST making WHM and SCH feeling more alike, though WHM did get more instant casts)

Im on board with seeing really unique tanks/healers. For tanks though they still require a moderate level of handling melee range mobs, but a hybrid of range/melee would still be refreshing Im talking more than just abyssal drain having sort of that type of effect.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

DPS already have seven jobs to choose from...

This is not necessarily true. Party comps typically have two of each role (melee or ranged), thus our decision is somewhat narrowed to those specific roles. You certainly can run triple of either, though few groups-- even casual-- do as mechanics can be cumbersome to handle and the loss of utility is far more noticeable. None this accounts for the sheer differences in DPS jobs. I prefer close quarter combat roles. Currently, that limits my choice to three DPS jobs: Monk, Dragoon and Ninja. Most people tend to focus on roles they fancy not the blanket term "DPS". Of course, this does not pertain to everyone but, then again, some tanks prefer Dark Knight and won't play anything else. You also have to consider DPS roles will always outnumber tanks and healers both due to content requiring more of them and player preference.

[Kanitezz]

Im not disappointed but I dont know WHY im not disappointed. I felt like I would care a lot more if Samurai wasnt a tank but... i dont. I guess im content with the current 3 tanks.