Got kicked from The Aetherochemical Research Facility by mentor

[Hasrat]

Im sorry, but the whole "im new to tanking this dungeon" is no excuse for pulling one group at a time ever. A level 60 tank should have developed these "mass pulling" habits sometime between tanking 2.0-3.0.

I sort of disagree trash mobs are trash mobs, at 60 you should be used to doing fast/decent sized pulls.

The problem with this sentiment is that, if things were actually meant/designed for mass pulling, they'd all just be grouped together to begin with. Big pulls is great, sure, more efficient, etc, etc, but every player is entirely free to play to their own style, and it's a bit of a dick move to expect/force players not comfortable with that to just suck it up to please (the collective) you. Can you really not see how toxic it is to say, "This is how we expect everyone to play the game at this point; get good or get out."?

Spamming "pull all" accomplishes nothing. Maybe the mentor could've accomplished more by actually encouraging and educating to that end. Be positive about it and you might actually get a new mass pull tank. Be a little htcib like OP mentor, and you could very well end up with one less tank in the game.

[Nirokun]

The problem with this sentiment is that, if things were actually meant/designed for mass pulling, they'd all just be grouped together to begin with. Big pulls is great, sure, more efficient, etc, etc, but every player is entirely free to play to their own style, and it's a bit of a dick move to expect/force players not comfortable with that to just suck it up to please (the collective) you. Can you really not see how toxic it is to say, "This is how we expect everyone to play the game at this point; get good or get out."?

Spamming "pull all" accomplishes nothing. Maybe the mentor could've accomplished more by actually encouraging and educating to that end. Be positive about it and you might actually get a new mass pull tank. Be a little htcib like OP mentor, and you could very well end up with one less tank in the game.

I think it's fairly obvious that monsters are spread to accommodate the least experienced players who struggle to fulfill their role. There has been a shift to pull more monsters because the playerbase has figured that there is a better/faster way to complete the dungeon, who push themselves and excel in their individual roles. This means everyone uses their CDs effectively to both live through large pulls as they are being killed quickly with AoE damage.

If certain players are not as well-accustomed to their roles and the rest of party would like to finish the dungeon quickly, it is completely fine to dismiss an underperforming member in favor of one who is able to play through regular dungeon content. This is a playstyle difference and dismissing someone under this pretense is completely legitimate.

Everyone is free to play their own style, but remember, you're in a party of other people, majority rules. Please stop villainizing superior play.

[Hasrat]

Everyone is free to play their own style, but remember, you're in a party of other people, majority rules. Please stop villainizing superior play.

As soon as you stop villainizing relaxing play? Lol. There's even that word there, "play," that suggests we don't have to dedicate every ounce of effort to the cause.
I mean, this argument won't get anyone anywhere, obviously, but again, there is this sentiment that you are literally saying "You're not good enough to play this game, get lost."

Might be worth asking, which mentality makes for a more toxic game? The players that just want to play, or the players that feel like they have to be pro and anyone not living up to their expectations isn't worth their time?

Does fun even factor into your considerations at all when playing? Or do you really just expect every run of every dungeon/raid/trial to run exactly the same, as long as everyone is performing at the level you want? The whole "different playstyle" argument is really kinda weak when you consider the end result is elitism and the removal of all variety and anything deemed different. What's even the point of playing the game at that stage? Just becomes mindless repetition.

Remember, you're in a party of people, and people come in all types. Isolate yourself if you want, yo, but isn't the whole point of MMO community play? Communities are a mixed bag.

Also worth mentioning I'm not trying to seem like I'm picking on you or anything. I just like being argumentative.

[Valenth]

snip

I can see where you're coming from but in the end I think kindness and understanding brings out the best in people. I also think that if you use the DF to go into dungeons you accept potentially having a slower run and running into new or less capable players. After all, that's why we get extra rewards, right? If there is a completely new player to the duty, especially a MSQ one, don't be a douche. Show how 'superior' your play is by maximising the situation while adjusting to accomodate and teach the new player in a kind and understanding way. Share your experience, try to make the new player feel comfortable so that later in their playtime they'll be a better AND friendlier player.

Anyway, the fast play you probably refer to as superior isn't being villainized here - efficiency is actually very good. It's the unexceptance from a mentor such as in the OP's situation which is. A mentor's job is literally stated in-game to be, when you click on accept for the mentor status, to accommodate to new players in proper etiquette. This accommodation in the shape of growing efficient and learning takes time, for some more than others. Denying said learning moments by kicking isn't helping at all. Kicking people instead of helping them, and you'll find people generally respond a LOT better to kindness and understanding, will in the long run contribute to a lower skillset of the community for we deny new people proper learning. For those of you wondering (and complaining) why the game continues to get easier: it's because it needs to be... and perhaps now we know why. Take time to properly teach your fellow player if you see them struggle instead of excluding, denying, bad mouthing and avoiding them. Not doing so is the thing that gets villainized here, because this behaviour is detrimental to our community, game and enjoyment in the long run.