16 hours of cross server zurvan extreme party finder: my thoughts

[Altena]

Learning party = new to the fight / still on the early phases.
Clear party = phase 3, already cleared or very close to clearing.
Farm party = a party that has cleared at least a few times, and is able to consistently clear it with minimal failed attempts.

If someone who has stepped into the fight once or twice, maybe seen phase 2, regardless how soon after the patch it is - They do not belong in a farm party.
People progress at different speeds. Some beat the fight within hours after the patch simply because that's their main priority. If they make a farming PF and you just unlocked it, then move right along and don't bother.

It is completely inconsiderate to waste the time of 7 other players, if you are not prepared for what the party expects of you when it is bluntly advertised.

There is nothing "elitist" about this.

[bswpayton]

Once again though, the difference is DF and PF. If I use the DF then I fully accept that I will get people from all skill levels, I will absolutely keep my mouth shut and try to be as helpful as possible and work towards helping other players improve whom may be new to the fight.

?

Even if they asked for experience, they essentially were asking for hours worth of experience or not even a days worth of doing the content experience so they got what they asked for which was essentially no experience because It just came out. Even the people who cleared when it first started still have only a two days worth of experience, so even they could make mistakes.

So its not like its a bird farm for bismark where the questions asked would be legit requirements because I don't know its been out more than a week. So still instead of the op asking pf members why not fc members up to their elite stature, or people on their friend list cause I'm sure they would have no incompetent players on their friends list. So maybe their was an outlier, but the others could have very well, made it to the phases asked by the op but their experience still would have been less than a days worth of it.

So maybe instead of complaining about it and bashing the whole player base they could of set real expectations for themselves, or gotten people that they knew where competent to do it just the way they would of liked it. And with my analogy the thing is, to answer your question is if it was game one then no I dont really think they would get frustarted because its game one just like it was day one on this game. The only difference is that players dont get to see all the other attempts , of people they go in parties with like the nfl players would see that high school juniors improvement over time. So if the op wanted to basically be like the first group that cleared , or mr happys group or others they should of already had a group of friends ready to go like they did. Thats what you do when you have a day one command like that , otherwise you just need to give other players time to get their footing and a few days to actually learn the whole fight through and through not on day one.

[Ashewalker]

I will put my two cents on this...

First - It's not SE's fault that the players can't or don't know how to play or do fights. They produce content and since they made the Alex Creator, Sophia and Zurvan more "Mechanics Based" than " DPS Based", everyone complains they are too easy... Well i pretty much preffer Mechanics based than Dps based because its less mindless than Dps races!!! You actualy have to bring yourself to learn and do the mechanics and not be GREEDY for dps!

Second - It's up to the players to learn and to push themselves to be better, learn from others, ask for opinions on rotations, the list goes on!! After all, this is a MMORPG, that means that you are the one responsible for your own improvements, not Square Enix! If they dont want to push themselves, their problem, but the ones that do want to try are met with raging demons like the onwer of this thread that only care for people that already KNOW how the fights work!

In other words, People aren't born taught, they have to learn by their own choise and not by other people's expectations. Do not flame someone that wants to learn a fight, that wants to learn how to dps, instead, help them and make them better.

If a person that doesn't know the fight enters a Clear, then tell them nicely to go on a practice and take it's time to learn, then enter a clear. Not like people i see 100% of the time that go " KICK HIM!!! HE IS A NOOB!" ... i lose faith in people when i see this...

Anyway, my two cents.

[Dement]

Even if they asked for experience, they essentially were asking for hours worth of experience or not even a days worth of doing the content experience so they got what they asked for which was essentially no experience because It just came out. Even the people who cleared when it first started still have only a two days worth of experience, so even they could make mistakes.

So its not like its a bird farm for bismark where the questions asked would be legit requirements because I don't know its been out more than a week. So still instead of the op asking pf members why not fc members up to their elite stature, or people on their friend list cause I'm sure they would have no incompetent players on their friends list. So maybe their was an outlier, but the others could have very well, made it to the phases asked by the op but their experience still would have been less than a days worth of it.

So maybe instead of complaining about it and bashing the whole player base they could of set real expectations for themselves, or gotten people that they knew where competent to do it just the way they would of liked it. And with my analogy the thing is, to answer your question is if it was game one then no I dont really think they would get frustarted because its game one just like it was day one on this game. The only difference is that players dont get to see all the other attempts , of people they go in parties with like the nfl players would see that high school juniors improvement over time. So if the op wanted to basically be like the first group that cleared , or mr happys group or others they should of already had a group of friends ready to go like they did. Thats what you do when you have a day one command like that , otherwise you just need to give other players time to get their footing and a few days to actually learn the whole fight through and through not on day one.

They asked for that experience whether it was "attainable" or not. They absolutely did not ask for no experience because it just came out. It's very easy to not join a party that you do not have the requisite experience for. If the OPs party never filled because people knew they could not meet the requirements he asked for and that's why he didn't clear it then that would be on the OP asking for something that others couldn't provide. That's not what happened. People joined his party with those requirements knowing full well that they didn't meet them. This is just as rude and obnoxious as the elitists behavior that people get so up in arms about. Whether you believe the OPs requirements were legit or not on day 1 content is no excuse for people to join parties that are asking for more experience than they know that they have.

The OPs first post was indeed heavy handed; however, when people are frustrated they don't always express themselves in the most appropriate manner. There have been quite a few dissenters of OPs first post that were less than appropriate as well. The OP has since posted two additional times, one of which even said he/she regretted lumping the whole player base together for the actions of a few in that first post.

[Khanscott]

Was literally blacking out in ZEX b/c 3.5, what is sleep? This is what I figured out thus far:

P1: Obvious circle & quarter sections that fall.
P2: 3 lines go across the arena 6 ppl have to evenly spread for then stack minus a healer x 2. 270 degree move based on halberd or tail, ice move that you bait when blue flash happens, 90 degree tank cleave. Move in or out 360 aoe if you don't phase push.
Adds, kill the meteor caster while looking away from gaze add (repeat).
P3: Pretty much beefed up P2 with player teathers ala T11 with beam that puts bleed on person marked + everyone in the way. Stack on matching colors with teathered person or raid wipe.

That was one lockout and I was not functional in any degree. Saw 2%. People either need to get good and not expect to be carried this early into the patch or set up some priorities of what to do. Want to get geared on limited timeframe? Focus combat and stick to one class, PF Alex farms and prioritize drops.

ZEX is NOT an i270 fight, whoever thinks anything above i260 is required is on some real good stuff. Not hard, just hard hitting with a hint of lag with everyone murderzerging the servers. Set up a learning party and make your expectations clear.

[Erim-Nelhah]

The way I read it, the OP was angry not because he'd spent 16 hours wiping, but rather because he took 2 hours to learn the fight and probably got Zurvan to near death a few times during that time, and then, for 14 hours, he tried to set up clear parties where he made it clear that he wanted players who'd seen all phases, and got players who hadn't seen all phases, hadn't learned the mechanics, and sometimes had joined his party having never been in Zurvan EX and only having (maybe) watched a clear vid or 2 and/or read about it on reddit (there were no video guides up that day) despite the fact that he said "have experience".

Trust me, if I had put up with that for 14 hours, I'd be mad too. Only I wouldn't have - I would be suffering from raid fatigue after 2-3 hours, and would have taken a break, day off or no.

--Erim Nelhah

[bswpayton]

They

The question still remains , the op said they mastered the fight in two hours so they are sayin they are a good player and catch on well. So my question is why did they not just have a party together already or instead of spending 14 hours tryin to do this through pf, why not just ask friends or fc members. So all the blame cant be placed on the party finder members when this wasnt the only option that the op had. If you want to clear the new extreme day one then go with people you know dont put it up in party finder and tell everyone they should know the mechanics on the very first day of its existence. Like I said the first group to clear wasnt a pf group it was a premade party already if the op wanted to be like them then they should of done the samething that they did.

[Mycow8me]

OP...

Why don't you just find a group of 7 other like minded and skilled players instead of trying to limit a public system of players who just may not be as good as you. Make your own private group or circle. People can improve with time, I don't understand why people would go out of there way to limit a playerbase from content because of skill level. If you are one of those people who don't feel comfortable leading a group or finding a group, that's your problem. Don't take it out on everyone else.

I look at it this way... If everyone was an exceptional player, content would be overall either too easy or just impossible... No one would ever hardly make a mistake and the game really would feel scripted.

We don't find out how good/skilled we really are till were in that group with players that you have to support/encourage/teach. There will be those players that don't care but that's just part of it.

The true challenge and test of your abilities comes from how well you can adapt, improvise, and overcome a situation as it develops in a raid. I actually find those intense situations where for example on titan extreme its just 1 or 2 dps up, a healer, and a tank up and you still have to keep struggling. Half of a 24man raid has wiped and your party struggles for a recovery. The heat of the moment is what I find the most challenging and fun. I just don't understand why ppl are so annoyed by players with lower skill or slow learners.

[LadyKairi]

snip.

Your same logic could be applied to the lesser skilled people. They could find parties of their own of similar skilled people and not deal with PF. But PF is there as a tool people use to find other people within their skill range. Doesn't matter if it was day one at all! There still were hundreds of people online at the time. OP is not the only person who was on of their "skill level". To think there were no one else on with their ability to learn or their same thoughts is just ignorant. Why does anyone have to form a premade anyways? PF is there for a reason, people of every type should be able to use it! If people have their PF described in a way to find others of their level, that should be fine. No one should HAVE to find friends to do everything with. You don't make new friends that way.

[LadyKairi]

Did OP come off a bit harsh? Yes... But to tell them they shouldn't use PF is absurd. PF is there for everyone, of every type. Whether you like it or not, people have a right to set expectations for their parties. When they were trying to clear, there were already people with farm parties up! So obviously the OP wasn't the only person who was getting through zurvan super fast. So telling them not to utilize PF for a clear when people were utilizing it for farms ON THE FIRST DAY is just dumb. It is there for EVERYONE to use. Not a special few.