Have we moved to an age where taking hate as a dps = bad dps instead of bad tank?

[HoodRat]

There's this new thing called teamwork. Why force your tank into tank stance and lower their dps just because you don't want to hit one extra button? If tanks and healers know what they're doing, tank stance is rarely needed for survival, just enmity. Idk why but a lot of dps I see don't care about the group and just refuse to use their enmity control abilities.

[chocopoko]

yep. it's pretty useful to look at your tank's items to check if you'd need to pop the reduce aggro skills before starting the fight. that and having the awareness of aggro meter in the party info

[Ilan]

yep. it's pretty useful to look at your tank's items to check if you'd need to pop the reduce aggro skills before starting the fight. that and having the awareness of aggro meter in the party info

No during your opener you use your emnity reducing skills and usualy during the fight too if the fight takes a while and the cd is back up no matter how good the tank is geared.

[Warkupo]

Tell that to bard burst. It hits like a truck and happens so fast that there is no gradual climb in the enmity meter. Even with Quelling, you can literally take hate from a slightly under-geared or sub-par tank before they even have time to react.

You can only adjust your DPS so much before you're you've nerfed yourself into obscurity.

1st-2nd-voke-3rd

It's not like a tank is helpless against a high output DPS. If they want to spike right at the start they can. Warning macro might be nice though.

[winsock]

OP, look at it this way:
1 button click of QS solves your problem.

Alternatively:
Several button clicks typing the tank a message increasing group drama
+
A several more button clicks to create a forum post about it.


IMO: just use QS. You are inconveniencing yourself.

[SolBadGuy]

Tanks have Tanks stance for one reason:doing their job in a good way.
Going in a dungeon with the DPS stance,losing aggro and then complaining with dpses for stealing aggro is stupid.Period.
To tell you the truth,it's a 50/50 thing.Tank didn't make his job by losing aggro and don't use the Tank stance and DPS didn't make his job in trying to ease the rotation as he HAVE TO SEE that the Tank was in dps stance.
Conclusion: peeps don't often care about team composition,gear and work.
You see a Tank doing the dps and refusing to do his job?Ease the rotation and use your skills to prove you're intelligent lol.
You see a DPS going into "KING OF THE SLAUGHTER" mode?Use your tank stance and stop being stupid.

That's my 2 cents guys.

[Ilan]

Tanks have Tanks stance for one reason:doing their job in a good way.
Going in a dungeon with the DPS stance,losing aggro and then complaining with dpses for stealing aggro is stupid.Period.
To tell you the truth,it's a 50/50 thing.Tank didn't make his job by losing aggro and don't use the Tank stance and DPS didn't make his job in trying to ease the rotation as he HAVE TO SEE that the Tank was in dps stance.
Conclusion: peeps don't often care about team composition,gear and work.
You see a Tank doing the dps and refusing to do his job?Ease the rotation and use your skills to prove you're intelligent lol.
You see a DPS going into "KING OF THE SLAUGHTER" mode?Use your tank stance and stop being stupid.

That's my 2 cents guys.

So you think its totaly fine if a dps is not using his skills properly and its totaly fine if the party gets slowed down because of that?

If you answer that question with no, then overthink your offending post again and correct it. If you answer that question with a yes, then no one can help you anymore.

A hint for you: A good dps watches his hate and does everything to allow the tank to drop tank stance and deal as much dps as possible.

[SeriousxSarcasm]

A hint for you: A good dps watches his hate and does everything to allow the tank to drop tank stance and deal as much dps as possible.

"Everything?" Even pulling hits? Sit on our hands and not do our rotations right because the tank doesn't actually like tanking? Because I've got news: an optimum DPS will always do more DPS than a tank in DPS stance. Yes, even compared to a WAR (who is top of the tank-DPS scale, but still nowhere near a good BLM). Arguably, you're suggesting a new play style that will SLOW DOWN everything. If you notice the legit endgame tank guides, they say ON OCCASION, take off your tank stance to get out more Damage, but it's still the tank's job to watch aggro and put it back on if he/she starts to lose it. Even with anti-aggro skills, there's nothing we can really do. As SMN, I've had my raid leaders laugh at me for bothering with Quelling Strikes, "Dude, your DPS is split already because of your pet. If tank can't keep shit off of you even at full burst, he's got no damn business calling himself a tank."

So yes, I will watch aggro bars, but really if I have to watch it like a hawk and pull back, all it tells me is that I'm running with a gimp tank and titan-egi gets to come out for some fun LOL.

(fyi, I feel like we're talking to those healers that say "But I'm a healer! My job is to heal!!" Except it's tanks tryin to justify not using their tank skills with "I AM NOT A TANK. I AM A MIGHTY DAMAGE DEALER AND EVERYONE ELSE MUST ACCOMMODATE MY DELUSIONS" lol!).

[Ilan]

"Everything?" Even pulling hits? Sit on our hands and not do our rotations right because the tank doesn't actually like tanking? Because I've got news: an optimum DPS will always do more DPS than a tank in DPS stance. Yes, even compared to a WAR (who is top of the tank-DPS scale, but still nowhere near a good BLM). Arguably, you're suggesting a new play style that will SLOW DOWN everything. If you notice the legit endgame tank guides, they say ON OCCASION, take off your tank stance to get out more Damage, but it's still the tank's job to watch aggro and put it back on if he/she starts to lose it. Even with anti-aggro skills, there's nothing we can really do. As SMN, I've had my raid leaders laugh at me for bothering with Quelling Strikes, "Dude, your DPS is split already because of your pet. If tank can't keep shit off of you even at full burst, he's got no damn business calling himself a tank."

So yes, I will watch aggro bars, but really if I have to watch it like a hawk and pull back, all it tells me is that I'm running with a gimp tank and titan-egi gets to come out for some fun LOL.

(fyi, I feel like we're talking to those healers that say "But I'm a healer! My job is to heal!!" Except it's tanks tryin to justify not using their tank skills with "I AM NOT A TANK. I AM A MIGHTY DAMAGE DEALER AND EVERYONE ELSE MUST ACCOMMODATE MY DELUSIONS" lol!).

Thanks for making me laugh. Obviously you have 0 idea how to play a tank and now you want to be a cool guy where you want to tell me it slows down everything if you use 1 damn skill as a dps. No one said something from hold your dps back, just that you should use your damn aggro reducing skills, the rest is obviously the tanks job and a tank who knows how to play keeps the hate without tank stance.

I really start to think people enjoy trolling or have absolutly no idea how to play a dps and tank classes properly.

[Chubby13]

Wait wait wait wait you comparing Tank DPS numbers to an actual DPS' numbers? Obviously a DPS SHOULD be doing more damage than a tank in their DPS-stance, if the tank is doing more damage than a DPS out of tank stance then I will surely question the poor DPS on the DPS' part. If the people in your group are laughing at you for using a beautiful skill such as Quelling Strikes then clearly they know nothing about Raid DPS, since that would stop the tank from doing a decent amount of damage, because he is forced to fight off aggro from people to lazy to push one simple button that they should be pressing. Imagine a healer not using Shroud of Saints/Lumineferous Aether, they would 100% ripped aggro from a tank since that is their AGGRO REDUCING skills, because healing generates a ton of aggro especially overhealing. So whose fault would that be? The tank or the healer?