Naoki Yoshida's Comment in Regard to Jump Potions/Boost Potions

[Yeol]

"We listen to the community, but only when it doesn't involve money" - Naoki Yoshida

I'm sure Yoshi P won't mind if we kick every player who can't play properly when we see they only have a week of playtime yet are at level 60.

You'll find players with months of experience who still don't know how to play.

I've said it more than once and I will say it again, good players are not determined by how long they have been playing, it its the effort they put into learning.

[Velhart]

Uh, no. You look to WoW and see the mistake they made. You don't repeat it. They attempted to adjust all their prior content and neglected enough new content, resulting in one of the worst received expansions in their history. Let that be a listen for FFXIV to not emulate.

Actually it was pretty well received. It was end game raids and lack of interesting updates that Cataclysm is met to mediocre reviews. The fact the world got revamped from Deathwing blowing up was awesome. It felt very fresh. I am not saying FFXIV should do it (actually they did...1.0) but this was one of the better aspects of Cataclysm.

You'll find players with months of experience who still don't know how to play.

I've said it more than once and I will say it again, good players are not determined by how long they have been playing, it its the effort they put into learning.

There are people who frequently play since Day 1 and still horrible at their job. Like you say, it is a player by player situation. Someone willing to learn and use the jump potion will still most likely come out a good player. If you are someone not willing to learn and only do what is considered the bare minimum but don't use a jump potion, chances are you will be considered a bad player even at 60.

[VTXShiva]

Actually it was pretty well received. It was end game raids and lack of interesting updates that Cataclysm is met to mediocre reviews. The fact the world got revamped from Deathwing blowing up was awesome. It felt very fresh. I am not saying FFXIV should do it (actually they did...1.0) but this was one of the better aspects of Cataclysm.

That's kind of the point. Dev time was sacrificed for that revamp. It was to illustrate that it didn't come cheap and it affected the overall perception of the expansion.
The 'blowing up' was fun until the novelty wore off and you had to swear at the chasm in the barrens or swim through 1k needles. People didn't stick with that expansion as they did prior.
While i agree that 1.0 is similar to Cataclysm, the idea here is that cataclysm was an interim expansion, intended to continue the game, not reset it. Intent, perception and re-evaluation do play a role here.

[Velhart]

That's kind of the point. Dev time was sacrificed for that revamp. It was to illustrate that it didn't come cheap and it affected the overall perception of the expansion.
The 'blowing up' was fun until the novelty wore off and you had to swear at the chasm in the barrens or swim through 1k needles. People didn't stick with that expansion as they did prior.
While i agree that 1.0 is similar to Cataclysm, the idea here is that cataclysm was an interim expansion, intended to continue the game, not reset it. Intent, perception and re-evaluation do play a role here.

The difference is the budget and team for WoW is much bigger than FFXIV's. They can afford the expenses and time to do this. Any real mistakes were more mismanaged decisions in how content should be done.

[Stanelis]

I would argue that it was both. It wasn't just a revamp of models.

The revamp occurred to implement flying to the old world. As I said, the revamp had mostly technical motivations, due to the large discrepancy between vanilla and the later expansions (be in in terms pf game design or on a technical standpoint).

They pruned stuff from the game because they said they had to make room for the new content.

Also, that's beside the point, as nothing so drastic is needed in FFXIV, due to the fact expansions are (mostly) homogeneous on a technical standpoint and it isn't what is being discussed in that topic.

But thats not gona make the game extra money if they are gona do it , they have to do it in a way thats gona benefit the profits of the game.

Actually if new players leave the game when they notice they either have to pay an extra or endure a tedious grind (be it in term of XP and MSQ), I m not sure it will benefit the game.

[ReplicaX]

"We listen to the community, but only when it doesn't involve money" - Naoki Yoshida

I'm sure Yoshi P won't mind if we kick every player who can't play properly when we see they only have a week of playtime yet are at level 60.

I'm sure you won't mind the repercussions from it.

I am going to bring up the evil called XI as its a good example:

XI's gating and grinding of levels had a player of an average playtime get their first job to 75 in about a 8 months to a year from 2002 until ToAU. Many still didn't know their job or have an appropriate subjob lvled.

Experience and time played isn't everything and you don't need a jump potion discussion to understand this.

[VTXShiva]

The difference is the budget and team for WoW is much bigger than FFXIV's.

I think we're arguing *for* the same point but just in case:
This is mainly why I advocate that the readjustment of the entire MSQ is a masive undertaking and that (if it will be done) it would take a long time to implement. Either it is done very slowly across one or more expansions, at which point it's a very long term solution, or it is done swiftly with impact on the quality of the next expansion, whichever that may be.
The potion IS a band-aid fix to the greater problem to an extent I agree. But if you're bleeding out of your knee, you cover it up with a towel until you can stitch it up. <- This is what people seem to fail to get around these parts.
FFXIV doesn't have the luxury to invest huge amounts of money and time without a return. They need to be stable and survive long enough to have these updates implemented (regardless of how well or poorly they are)

The revamp occurred to implement flying to the old world. As I said, the revamp had mostly technical motivations, due to the large discrepancy between vanilla and the later expansions (be in in terms pf game design or on a technical standpoint).
They pruned stuff from the game because they said they had to make room for the new content.
Also, that's beside the point, as nothing so drastic is needed in FFXIV, due to the fact expansions are (mostly) homogeneous on a technical standpoint and it isn't what is being discussed in that topic.

We're arguing past each other here.
If it was JUST technical, many of the quests and areas wouldn't have had to be outright re-shaped. You just remodel a mountain or terrain, you don't break it 5 add huge tornadoes, valleys, new monsters and more. They didn't NEED to do that.
Your second point is just making excuses for a point i wasn't making, but still ties into what I said.
I don't deny or think there is anything wrong with that. BUT this is precisely where some of the problem with FFXIV comes into play. Something like unlocking dungeons that have stories tied to them, would involve re-imagining the MSQ or re-adjusting cutscenes to other hooks. THAT is what takes time, making it work, not changing a 1 into a 0. And they made it very clear they do not want to do this at the detriment of story (at this point in time at least).

[Moonlite]

Actually if new players leave the game when they notice they either have to pay an extra or endure a tedious grind (be it in term of XP and MSQ), I m not sure it will benefit the game.

Sadly we have a generation of players now used to being screwed by games. No one blinks twice that FPS have maps out on day 1 that could have been in game. Or that most of EA sports have removed a huge chunk of (fluff to some) content to cash shop. Anyone over the age of thirty probably thinks this is a shitty decision. Anyone under probably just thinks all games micro transact you.

Also SE or some other company they paid has figured out what the threshold of screw people over and still max profits. That is the only reason I can think that they charge 18usd for a glamour but don't have it account wide.

[Miitan]

I'm sure you won't mind the repercussions from it.

I am going to bring up the evil called XI as its a good example:

XI's gating and grinding of levels had a player of an average playtime get their first job to 75 in about a 8 months to a year from 2002 until ToAU. Many still didn't know their job or have an appropriate subjob lvled.

Experience and time played isn't everything and you don't need a jump potion discussion to understand this.

I played FFXI for 6 years. If you were bad enough, everyone on the server knew your name and no one would party with you. DF in this game makes that impossible. Also, the number of bad players at 75 was tiny compared to this game at 60.

You are right in that there will always bad players, but this is about ensuring that bad players in DF are the exception rather than the rule.

[VTXShiva]

Also SE or some other company they paid has figured out what the threshold of screw people over and still max profits. That is the only reason I can think that they charge 18usd for a glamour but don't have it account wide.

Honestly, It's a system that literally exists because of people's greed. None of us "needs" that set of clothes to add to your already growing past 50 sets of clothes. You don't NEED that 30th mount or that 180th pet. I don't blame them for implementing them, some people are greedy and refuse to change, profit off of it if you can.

I played FFXI for 6 years. If you were bad enough, everyone on the server knew your name and no one would party with you.

FFXIV is also extremely niche and obscure by comparison even for its time. It only still exists due to SE being nice guys and keeping it up for the old guard. It would probably be more financially efficient for them to just mercy kill it at this point. Heck, at times i think the only reason it is still up, is because it's a mainline number game. There have been plenty offshoots killed already.