Making Jobs Rotationally Easier in 4.0

[Reynhart]

if surviving and holding hate required more effort, then maybe you could say that damage output is not in the tank's job description.

That's exactly what I think this game lacks. It has taken every core aspect of tanking and made it absurdingly easy. No wonder people say that DPSing is where tank players can really improve...
What I don't understand is how people don't see the problem of making what is a tank only the floor skill.

If you think tanking in FFXIV is so boring, why tank?

It's because I find it boring that I stopped raiding...then reduced my tanking time, and then my playing time...

EDIT: Just realized that if you'd told me six months ago that I'd be on this side of this discussion, I'd have called you a liar.

Times change...but I fear dark times for the game if it keep judging and balancing tanks only around their DPS output...

[Brian_]

Then please, tell me how greatly designed tanks are when it comes to actually tanking...tell me how great it is when every fight can be translated to a spreadsheet with every timer (and the CD rotation applied to it) clearly displayed...

That's how every job in this game plays -- even the ones more based on procs. You have a general framework for a fight based around optimized windows and CD usage and the rest is how you execute, micromanage / maximize GCDs, and react to limited RNG. If that's not the game you want to play, then you're playing the wrong game. Instead of being a petulant child and crying that things need to change because they aren't how you want them to be, maybe it's time you realized that this game is what it is.

It's still the same jobs into the same game...so no, it's the same stair. And if you really tink it's a different stair, then what you call the "actual learning curve" is even more nonsense.

Tanks don't play the same between dungeons and raids. That's why your stairway is broken. If you want to teach a tank how to excel as a raider, you need to teach them how to raid, not how to be a dungeon hero.

That's exactly what I think this game lacks. It has taken every core aspect of tanking and made it absurdingly easy. No wonder people say that DPSing is where tank players can really improve...
What I don't understand is how people don't see the problem of making what is a tank only the floor skill.

It's because I find it boring that I stopped raiding...then reduced my tanking time, and then my playing time...

Your perception of tanking lacks depth and understanding.

Yes, things like enmity and mitigation are easy at the entry level. They should be. This game needs more functional tanks just to keep the DF traffic flowing. But, if you understood exactly how tanks scaled upwards when pushing DPS, then you'd realize that the reality is the more you push DPS, the more challenging enmity and mitigation become. For some strange reason, you try to separate the different aspects of end-game tanking but any tank with actual experience knows that it's a fine balance between aspects.

When you are trying to maximize your SwO / Deliverance / Grit-less up-time, precise and appropriately gauged CD usage becomes significantly more important than when you're sitting there turtling up in ShO / Defiance / Grit. Formulating a sufficient CD rotation is significantly harder when you're planning around low tank-stance up-time. Once you reach the point where you realize that too much mitigation is a thing, you begin to understand the precise and exact quantities of mitigation you can have and how to manipulate it for max efficiency. That's certainly a more measured and intelligent grasp of the idea of mitigation than a meta where it's all mitigation all the time.

When you are trying to do a SwO / Deliverance / Grit-less cold pick-up on an add when your healers are forced to spam AoE heals and your DPS are going full throttle with no QS, it takes real skill (or a ninja, but that's another issue) and planning to snap aggro and stick the add. When you're sitting in tank stance spamming PS, BB and RoH, enmity is a complete non-issue. When you are near 100% SwO / Deliverance / Grit-less with elite DPS players challenging content that demands a lot of AoE healing and you're trying to maximize your DA SE / Delirium / RA usage or are forced to rotate Path / Eye, you suddenly need to watch your enmity.

Even the finer nuances of positioning matter more when you are trying to push your DPS. Things like barely avoiding AoEs to prevent the boss from shifting or losing / clipping a GCD, anticipating and knowing exactly how to position and rotate a boss as it leaps around the arena and constantly forces movement only really matter when you are trying to maximize DPS.

So everything you think defines a tank still very much matters and happens and is enabled by the DPS meta you apparently despise. It's just your bias that blinds you.

SE has designed the tank-meta so that the things you view as central to tanking are easy to pick-up but increasingly complex and difficult as you get better at the game and strive for mastery. That is how things should be in an MMO where accessibility matters and the bulk of your players are casual.

[Reynhart]

Instead of being a petulant child and crying that things need to change because they aren't how you want them to be, maybe it's time you realized that this game is what it is.

No, this is what you try to make the game be, and what SE is trying to prevent step by step...Came 3.0, they decided to remove any accuracy from healer's gear, to reduce their DPS output. After that, they changed tank's AP calculation to make them focus more en Vitality...and nerf their damage. They also prevent main stat overmelding which, for the record, was only ever useful to tanks to increase their DPS. They also reduced the need for DPS checks, and even focused mainly on parry and skillspeed for the last tome tank set. Parry, which is also planned to be reworked to be more useful.
If you don't understand that all of this screams "Stop bothering us with your damage output", then you're just covering your ears.

Tanks don't play the same between dungeons and raids.

Yes, they do. That's why you see more and more "raid" mechanics making their way in storyline fights, like tankbusters, packing and gazing mechanics, etc...Normal raids are just...slightly less forgiving. And for the record, dungeons are also too easy...which will change in SB (Confirmed by SE during Fanfest)

When you are trying to maximize your SwO / Deliverance / Grit-less up-time, precise and appropriately gauged CD usage becomes significantly more important than when you're sitting there turtling up in ShO / Defiance / Grit.

Ok, so you have a boss fight with a tankbuster every 50-60 seconds...tell me how stance dancing make your CD management "more precise" for that.