Unpopular suggestion: Make raiding (great) rewarding again.

[StrejdaTom]

So at what point during this game's raiding tiers did you feel SE had it right with their reward system, that you feel has since been lost?

I think that every long time raider's answer would be T1-12. But I am no selfish person, I understand that casual people want to enjoy "raiding" too, story too, etc.
I just want to return to the T1-12 as close as possible and feel atleast a bit like a special snowflake!

I know we did't have mounts and titles (except savage), but we won't get exclusive story too, so I am improvising here.

[FeliAiko]

I think that every long time raider's answer would be T1-12. But I am no selfish person, I understand that casual people want to enjoy "raiding" too, story too, etc.
I just want to return to the T1-12 as close as possible and feel atleast a bit like a special snowflake!

I know we did't have mounts and titles (except savage), but we won't get exclusive story too, so I am improvising here.

Okay, so it sounds like what you liked about raiding was the whole theme and atmosphere around it, and not so much the loot. The sense you were searching for answers, and the sense of discovery and revelation as you cleared each turn.

That's fair. Alexander lacks that same magic in comparison, which isn't helped by its comparatively weak story and antagonists (Goblins). I mean, the raid is centered around Alexander but he's not so much the main threat but rather the ones that's trying to activate him. Compared to Coil where the threat was Bahamut himself, alongside the thralls he sent against you (Nael, Louisoix) and the Allagan constructs designed to prevent you reaching him.

[StrejdaTom]

Okay, so it sounds like what you liked about raiding was the whole theme and atmosphere around it, and not so much the loot. The sense you were searching for answers, and the sense of discovery and revelation as you cleared each turn.

That's fair. Alexander lacks that same magic in comparison, which isn't helped by its comparatively weak story and antagonists (Goblins). I mean, the raid is centered around Alexander but he's not so much the main threat but rather the ones that's trying to activate him. Compared to Coil where the threat was Bahamut himself, alongside the thralls he sent against you (Nael, Louisoix) and the Allagan constructs designed to prevent you reaching him.

And we aren't getting anything from that back.
Story must be reachable for all, same for gear, same for the raid environment.
But giving raiders next to no rewards doesn't help too.

[zosia]

Okay, so it sounds like what you liked about raiding was the whole theme and atmosphere around it, and not so much the loot. The sense you were searching for answers, and the sense of discovery and revelation as you cleared each turn. That's fair. Alexander lacks that same magic in comparison, which isn't helped by its comparatively weak story and antagonists (Goblins). I mean, the raid is centered around Alexander but he's not so much the main threat but rather the ones that's trying to activate him. Compared to Coil where the threat was Bahamut himself, alongside the thralls he sent against you (Nael, Louisoix) and the Allagan constructs designed to prevent you reaching him.

But that will never be something a savage raid can capture again because of normal mode. That drive for secret lore and the epic build up boss kill after boss kill is just not there anymore. The worse part is that we have been force fed the story to unlock savage mode, so you can't even selectively preserve the story incentive for savage raiding.

That's why StrejdaTom probably wants to feel a bit like a special snowflake, there is nothing rewarding about the current raiding meta. We want to feel rewarded for time invested, for stepping up our game to the savage level.

[FeliAiko]

But that will never be something a savage raid can capture again because of normal mode. That drive for secret lore and the epic build up boss kill after boss kill is just not there anymore. The worse part is that we have been force fed the story to unlock savage mode, so you can't even selectively preserve the story incentive for savage raiding.

That's why StrejdaTom probably wants to feel a bit like a special snowflake, there is nothing rewarding about the current raiding meta. We want to feel rewarded for time invested, for stepping up our game to the savage level.

That's true, they can't make the story that engaging in that sense anymore. It's 'bad' enough they've taken away the feeling people got from progressing the story in Coil, but the story in itself isn't even that engaging for all its accessibility. No real twists or hook, or even likable characters to make you interested to see what happens next. Meanwhile, the 24 man raids IMO has a better setting and backstory behind it than Alexander does. Imagine if they swapped it around and had the Mhach as the 8-man and Alex as the 24man instead.

[Welsper59]

But that will never be something a savage raid can capture again because of normal mode. That drive for secret lore and the epic build up boss kill after boss kill is just not there anymore. The worse part is that we have been force fed the story to unlock savage mode, so you can't even selectively preserve the story incentive for savage raiding.

That's why StrejdaTom probably wants to feel a bit like a special snowflake, there is nothing rewarding about the current raiding meta. We want to feel rewarded for time invested, for stepping up our game to the savage level and not just with gear.

Added the bolded for clarity. I think this is just one of those situations where a group of players has to compromise. Either the people who want to be that special snowflake again (see old school raid prestige) or the players who want the story and easier raiding but aren't able to do Savage difficulty content. Neither side will, of course, but that's the bottomline of the complaint.

IMO, something like this would be the compromise on both ends: Special snowflake team will get little bonus content, be it additional phases or a new boss exclusive to Savage completion, CG, in-game story, fun item drops, or whatever on the matter, while everyone else gets the usual normal outcome. Like how beating non-MMO games on their hardest difficulty tends to do from time to time. Or Algalon in WoW, if anyone knows of that.

I don't see the harm in giving outstanding rewards, going above and beyond, for people who complete the hardest content in the game at the time. Then again, this is coming from someone speaking from the early days of MMORPGs, rather than from today's point of view where everything must be equal to everyone regardless of effort. If their reward is even remotely something I want, that's too good for them just because they can put in "a little" more effort into playing the game, as opposed to my just facerolling to victory. If I can't get it, they shouldn't either... you know, those types.