Forcing NA Duty Finder to be better, we need a grading system.

[Fevelle]

Bumping with relevant link to the type of players that you can expect in DF. Prime example of the target audience that do require help and realisation to what they're doing is not acceptable.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...9p&sh=7faa4f73

I have yet to run into a party like this in 1 and a half years playing this game with 3 different characters.

But tell me, how would a grade system fix that? Do you really think that someone that isn't bothered by staying 1:15 hours in a dungeon would bother with grades? lol

[CrystalRainbow]

How do you do this.
It's never as easy as just RAW Numbers....
You say Duty Roulette Trail.
2 Tank 2 Healer 4 DPS.

now say party make up is BRD BLM DRG NIN
If everyone Ilevel is the same BRD is going to have the lowest DPS
Nothing can be done about that. unless the FR dmg bonus is added to the BRD and taken away from the BLM
There are just so many factors to rate this way. Rare numbers don't mean your playing your job right.

Then the off tank gets Rated down because they didn't take as much dmg.

[Masekase_Hurricane]

The system would calculate your rank, the players won't. It'd be calculated via various stats such as healing done, damage done, overheal percent, etc.

So we have player A enters DF they have cleared Savage and Ex fights many times, but this week they are having ISP problems and has now been labelled crap by DF. This pushes the player down the ranks with less skilled players. So now we have player A getting annoyed at lower ranked players who in turn down vote him or kick him cause of his attitude. Now player A is back in the normal duty finder with a mixed bunch :P

[Underdog2204]

Just to add I've never had major issues with my DF groups... Not once (other than some peoples attitude). The vast majority of players accept advice when given constructively and I'm sure there are exceptions but it is not the rule. The issue with the community is people exactly like the people complaining in this thread. Instead of them adjusting their attitues and learning a little patcience and understanding they expect things to be fixed for them. It's sheer laziness and unwillingness to work with others, which ironically is exaclty like those "percieved" people they are moaning about.... I say "percieved" because I doubt they take any steps to advise people who are underperforming and instead just write them off as someone unwilling to learn without so much as a word.

[Heart-of-Asia]

snipped

This so much. I've been playing over a year and most of the "problems" come from people with terrible attitudes. No one talks in parties and when someone is new, no one really tells them the mechanics. People claim to want to work better as a team but they aren't really willing to work as a team. Some of the problems in this game was already hit on in this thread. We got people forcing others into speed runs where you can pretty much ignore mechanics. But then they get thrown into a party down the road that requires these mechanics but they never really learned them.

[Remus]

snip

I see some people say this but it complete nonsense. You can't just say its mainly people with terrible attitudes. Also if you full well know you are new its not hard to just type in chat "I'm new could you tell me the mechanics." Majority of the time new players don't do that so people will assume they know what to do from looking it up. People do want to work as a team. If you are going to stay silent when being new don't expect people to suddenly start throwing mechanics at you.

Use your words don't just blame non-new players. Also its DF you need to deal with the potential chance of getting some people in your group who want to speedrun that doesn't mean they have a terrible attitude. If you don't want that make a PF saying slow run its not hard. (wonder how long that will fill up... hehe..)

Also most people do speedruns because they know classes are capable of doing that instead of complaining about them why not instead spend your time getting a bit better so you wouldn't have issues with it. It's not hard to speedrun a dungeon you just use AoE attacks. Is that to hard for people? If it is I have no faith in community when it comes to content.

[Underdog2204]

Snip

What was being said there went over your head it seems -_-

1) No-one speaks ever (well certainly nearly everyone who isn't me it seems). You get a message at the start saying someone is new and a quick "know what to do?" and you get a yes or no answer, it's not hard... Complaining they didn't say anything and just assuming they know without even thinking to ask is rich...

2) The point of the post you are replying to was saying if everyone speed runs all the time and no-one speaks how is anyone supposed ot learn? Hell actually going back to my first point how the hell is a new person supposed to ask in that enviornment?

If someone is new to a dungeon someone should take the initative and either ask or the new person might very well say they don't know. Why don't you take the initative instead of expecting it to be done for you?

[WinterLuna]

I can't believe this thread is still going. We do not need this implementing into FFXIV. All it will do is segregate the community, and the same people requesting this will be on the forums complaining about queue times a week later.

I am a fairly good player, I am not afraid of being graded, but I don't want to be. I play this for fun, not to be treated like a student taking an exam every time I enter a dungeon.

[Kaurie]

While I think that your idea is a little convoluted for what I think should just be a DPS Parser + the creation of social norms and pressure, it certainly has its merits.

One thing of note is that the dev team does seem to add things in a very convoluted manner - so perhaps this idea will appeal to them?

[Miste]

I have yet to run into a party like this in 1 and a half years playing this game with 3 different characters.

Just because you have not run into one doesn't mean others haven't. The bad DF groups exist. You just got lucky, you run with friends a lot, or your idea of bad takes a very extreme higher level of badness for you to notice.

We are even on the same data center and I have a long list of DF parties of people basically leeching off others to get their rewards because they are either completely oblivious to how to play their job even after getting to 60, some refuse to take any advice or help by completely ignoring you or even with some verbal abuse at you if you try, or they just don't care they are wasting their teammate's time. I've also leveled like 3 characters and have been playing for basically 3 years since the 3rd anniversary is about to hit this month.

See how different our experiences are? Saying you've never run into this problem yourself is kind of pointless to say.

As for the grading I personally don't think it will help much to reduce the amount of bad players, but I am just basically neutral I don't care if they add one or don't add one (I'd kind of like it added so I can have fun with it by challenging myself to do better but I do the SSS for that too). It will help the oblivious ones who don't realize they are doing so badly but don't know it and want to do better, but I think those types might be the minority of the bad players?

I'm only speculating but it seems to me most of the bad players are the ones who just don't care and/or verbally harass anyone who tries to give them advice to help them play better. To those types of bad players it is "their game" and "their time" even in group content which requires other real players to assist them to complete it (as in non-solo content); so they obviously don't have the mental capacity to actually care about and give consideration to anyone else in the group or their game or their time. It's all about them and they basically consider the rest of the group just NPCs to do the work to clear for them. Which is a totally wrong mindset to have in group teamwork environment.

So I do agree with you that the grading system won't really help these types of bad players. A grading system doesn't have to be a bad thing though. The OP specifically says that "This rank will be hidden and only for you to see" so it can help those who want to improve privately and help people try harder to obtain their personal best. If it is a personal thing I do not see what harm it can do. Oh edit but it should not segregate queues based on rank; that is not needed.