Players Who Don't pull their weight.

[Mattelot]

Based on my comment having been up for only a couple minutes and there is proof that people agree with it, that tells me that I haven't just completely made up anything. If it's any measure on how many people on this particular thread that agree with you, I'd say you're not looking so hot in this current company.

In case you didn't see when I said it the first time, I could literally give 2 poops less about what trolls think about me. So if you think "i'm not looking so hot"... all I can really say is... cool, man! Good luck next time, my friend.

[Saito_S]

In case you didn't see when I said it the first time, I could literally give 2 poops less about what trolls think about me. So if you think "i'm not looking so hot"... all I can really say is... cool, man! Good luck next time, my friend.

Huh. I thought it was only the Mean Elitist Tryhards that engaged in that whole "if they don't agree with me then they're trolls!" fallacy? Coulda sworn I saw someone espousing that viewpoint in another thread recently...

Translation: This person has a different opinion than mine so they must be a troll!

You really need to take off your tin foil hat. If you want to "solve problems" as you put it, offer suggestions instead of always being so negative towards anyone who doesn't think like you do.

Oh right!

You tell people to offer suggestions instead of "being so negative" toward others, then tell people who criticize you that you don't give a flying rat's ass what they think. That makes total sense.

This thread is incredible. I've read most of it (over the course of a few days), and it seems to me that the reason it's gone on SO long is that the "pro-low expectations/don't expect good play in DF" side keeps taking the ball and running to one extreme end of the field after every play. I don't even know how many times the "anti-low expectations/at least TRY to play your job at a basic level, please" side has - during this thread - explicitly denounced being mean to people, explicitly agreed with the idea that it can be difficult if you have someone who is legit doing their best but simply isn't able to play this game very well because you don't want to be mean to them, explicitly said this is mainly about people doing even LESS than the bare minimum, etc. Yet every page or so, someone comes roaring in with accusations that the "anti-low expectations side" is advocating insulting people, or advocating that people with disabilities that make it harder to play should be banned from the game.

To stave off anyone quoting certain posts and challenging what I've said above: naturally I don't mean that literally EVERYONE on the "anti-low expectations side" has been a shining beacon of civility and reason. There have been people on that side who've said things I disagree with (for example, a page or two back, Seraphix said that if one person can "nail" a rotation in a couple hours, anyone can, and I don't believe this is true in the blanket sense he stated; someone else since challenged him on that and he backed off on the idea).

I also believe that any kind of system where players can rate each other, and your aggregate rating would have consequences in the future, is a terrible idea and would never work like its advocates want it to.

None of that changes the fact that people aren't asking for super amazing elite high level play when fighting the Spriggan squads in Copperbell Normal. But spamming Blizzard 2 when you're across the room from any enemies? A healer literally waiting, standing there doing nothing until the tank loses a sliver of HP then casting cure 1 then going back to waiting? A dragoon spamming one move over and over?

No one is saying people who do that should be banned from the game or sent to prison. People ARE saying that such play isn't acceptable, isn't "that's just how I play!", and that others in the party have a right to be upset by it, to (politely) call it out and offer advice, etc. People ARE saying that the idea that we should all just suck it up, carry them (yes of course it's possible to carry someone in DF. lol), and never say anything to any of them because "that's just DF lawl" is absurd.

[Bloody]

No one is saying people who do that should be banned from the game or sent to prison. People ARE saying that such play isn't acceptable, isn't "that's just how I play!", and that others in the party have a right to be upset by it, to (politely) call it out and offer advice, etc. People ARE saying that the idea that we should all just suck it up, carry them (yes of course it's possible to carry someone in DF. lol), and never say anything to any of them because "that's just DF lawl" is absurd.

1000 times this.

[Aarik]

In case you didn't see when I said it the first time, I could literally give 2 poops less about what trolls think about me. So if you think "i'm not looking so hot"... all I can really say is... cool, man! Good luck next time, my friend.

Huh.....now that's interesting....lemme see here....

Obysuca, again, none of those posts say that everyone is like that. You're still grasping at straws here.

Referring to:

I've never once said that anyone who questions my playstyle is an Elitist.

So, according to you, everyone that agrees with Klamor's post (in his argument against you) is, in your words

I could literally give 2 poops less about what trolls think about me.

, a troll. Yet you totally deny using blanket statements. Buddy, I've been trying to see both sides of the argument for this entire thread, but you're making it very hard to take you seriously.