Xeno believes paladin should NEVER be main tank

[KrenianKandos]

My group and I just have no use for them. We did almost all of coil 1 completely different..to the point where when we went in the DF people were acting like we were idiots for not doing it how "the videos do", looking at videos for ideas or to better oneself is fine, but you have to understand where I am coming from. I agree wtih you 100%. Again, if others do..that is fine, I 100% respect them. My raid leader invents strategies and rotations and helps everyone in my group to learn...so no need for videos for us

Curious question for you: Does your leader at least research the attacks a boss does in order to do said strategies or do you go in blindly? Curious because it would be easier to plan if you actually knew at least of the attacks. But I could understand just going in and getting blasted and laughing about it because, simply put, you have no idea what to expect and part of the fun, like a puzzle, is to figure out how to deal with a mechanic.

[Iromi]

Curious question for you: Does your leader at least research the attacks a boss does in order to do said strategies or do you go in blindly? Curious because it would be easier to plan if you actually knew at least of the attacks. But I could understand just going in and getting blasted and laughing about it because, simply put, you have no idea what to expect and part of the fun, like a puzzle, is to figure out how to deal with a mechanic.

Sure We go in blindly and he adapts on the fly and explains the mechanics to us and what to do almost instantly. A lot of times he also suggests us things to try as a group to test the waters and it usually bodes well once we all can grasp it. Although yes the first few wipes are always a riot and shock..LOL that is the most fun part if you ask me! Takes him about 1 blind run to get it step by step and a few to figure out how to explain it to our group. Hehe and he does not use any guides or anything, this I know because I sit right next to him when we play ^^

ah I get you. well honestly to the general player base the only people that are big are probably just mr.happy and misteq. That's about it imo.

and honestly blind runs can be far more fun and more rewarding. Just glad your group is having fun doing what they are doing. Raid groups are supposed to find best methods that work for them instead of just copying world first players. Looks like you guys are doing that just fine haha.

OH yeah...blind runs are the best! Love it thanks and yeah..I see waht you are saying...when I checked out some FFXIV guides on youtube just now I saw those names pop up, all good!

and yes, raid groups are supposed to find best methods that work for them. Much more rewarding that way and I find things tend to go more smooth with our raid leader calling stuff out as it happens and what to do...instead of saying hey guys go watch this video lol

[KuraiKiserogeru]

Videos

Just on the “video topic making subject alone”.

Mr.Happy has been known to make long and complicated videos about the game fights, without all the right facts and rushing his videos for that YouTube cash grab. He gained his popularity because at the time he was the only one making videos.

MizzTeq's videos began to outshine his, however lately there has been bad video misinformation and mechanics explanation skipping, such as A3s and A7s. Which reddit gave feedback on as the A7s guide has incorrect information on some mechanics. A3s they were stuck on because they wouldn’t change their strategy, lost static members and ended up posting a very late video. 5 months later when the still together and not "static killed" groups where beating it.

Xeno takes time on creating videos and waits until he understands all the mechanics and experiences it to give a better flowing guide. So sure, bash away at someone who is having a positive contribution to the XIV community. People may use guides, people may not use guides. But there’s a difference when these guides are giving the right and wrong information for the people that wish to watch and learn.

[Iromi]

I never bashed on any of them, I was never insulting nor rude to anyone in any single way. Strawman is really unbecoming you know...

I went as far to say its cool if they do that and have fun...where did I bash on these folks who make videos? Lol.

It comes down to the fact that I simply just do not care >.> If me not caring is bashing then...okie doki!

[Reynhart]

It comes down to the fact that I simply just do not care >.> If me not caring is bashing then...okie doki!

Like Jpec said, the main point is not really what Xeno thinks, it's that there's still a real issue about PLD's value, even if it's not as important as 3.0-3.1.

[Elfr]

Lets hit the brakes for one second, before the wagon falls of its tracks.

The three tanks we have are presented to us as options that meet the different play-styles of many players. Regardless of how many abilities or responsibilities they all share, the premise is that their formulae for output is designed differently at the core.

Paladin is designed to be smooth, efficient, and stout. For players who like to safeguard their group and steadily progress towards completion.

Warrior is designed for players who thrive off of aggressive and quick-execution of the enemies. Their heightened strength fulfills the reward of players who are built for dpsing, regardless of their loyalty or understanding of the role of the tank. This is fine.
Continued below...

[Elfr]

Drk, like all of the HW classes, is a compromise, and a risky one at that, of both worlds. While delivering a new agenda for approaches and rotation, it is simply a WAR under shield oath. Give it a permanent Maim, and a permanent damage reduction, thus giving it a more steady ramp up/sustain. That's all it is. Same way that AST is just a whm w/ the so sought-after insta "lustrate" (being Essential D.)

Three different pathways, because only 1 tanking role would be stale. Now; is warrior the best tank? Yea, you know what, it is. But on a similar analogy; is the piano the most broad and expressive instrument on an orchestra? YYYYYYYYYeeeeaa.... it kinda is. So on that note, why don't just put 10 pianos next time you go to a concerto? Uhhhh, it's called Tessitura. Music needs texture and feel, and so does this game. Having a Deliverance WAR kicking ass while the main healer basically wipes the sweat off his every pore on every 3k auto attack isn't the texture I demand from FF14.

[Elfr]

I'm betting all my 3 year experience on this game that a great PLD allows for the same raid dps as does a great WAR. Because while yea WAR can solo titan ex, and PLD can't, PLD is still the mitigation king. It cannot kill an enemy, but it cannot also die. A stalemate we have all secretly come to love since the release of the class, one that you must accept if you call yourself a PLD main. A great PLD would increase the dps output of healers to the point it would match the dps output of a WAR, plain and simple. If we cannot see this, then we are spitting on Square Enix's face.

[Reynhart]

But on a similar analogy; is the piano the most broad and expressive instrument on an orchestra? YYYYYYYYYeeeeaa.... it kinda is. So on that note, why don't just put 10 pianos next time you go to a concerto? Uhhhh, it's called Tessitura. Music needs texture and feel, and so does this game.

There is a little problem with your analogy. The quality of music is a very subjective topic. Different people will have different taste, and the music you made will seem beautiful for one person and not for another. You can say that by using this or that instrument, you define a unique goal for your music.

In this game, there is only one goal : Killing ennemies. And this is only achieved by bringing their HP to 0, so whoever does this the fastest will have a clear advantage (Since every tank is sturdy enough to survive any encounter)
Besides, you call PLD a "progress" job...and yes, it kinda is. But progress is not a goal, it's not a final step. You can't have a job which is only "better", or, I should say, "safer", for intermediate goal. That mentality is as flawed as Yoshi-P saying they need an "entry level" tank. At level 60, you're clearly way past beyond entry level.

So, from a musical standpoint, PLD is like the Casio Keyboard you use as a kid to learn music...and WAR is a true piano.

[FallenWings]

I'm betting all my 3 year experience on this game that a great PLD allows for the same raid dps as does a great WAR. Because while yea WAR can solo titan ex, and PLD can't, PLD is still the mitigation king. It cannot kill an enemy, but it cannot also die. A stalemate we have all secretly come to love since the release of the class, one that you must accept if you call yourself a PLD main. A great PLD would increase the dps output of healers to the point it would match the dps output of a WAR, plain and simple. If we cannot see this, then we are spitting on Square Enix's face.

The problem with this method of raid damage contribution is that it is ultimately unreliable. As far as I'm aware, healers do not account for Parries or Blocks in their rotational healing. Fights are scripted enough where healers who know the timings will heal and deal damage on a strict timer unless they're fixing stupid. Healing is also powerful or can get powerful enough that the extra 20% from Sheltron will not matter if both tanks only need 1 cure to heal all damage, thus nullifying the potential healer DPS increase it could have provided.

At best you could argue that Hallowed Ground provides 3 free healer GCD's with it's 10 second duration and no requirement of a benediction versus Holmgang's 6 and benediction requirement. But then Living Dead blows both of them out of the water with its 18 second potential if we're talking about such high coordinated play.