Difficulty of ALC potions

[Mindy_Macready]

You make assertions, and I counter. This is called discussion. If you have a problem with me calling you out on faulty reasoning, then dont make a thread to discuss the issue

Except you haven't done anything that resembles a discussion at all. You just talk to points that nobody has made, and argue them as if you're countering points that haven't been stated.

And the only reason why I put in a bunch of quotes and hightlighting exactly where the issue I had with you is, is because in previous threads you claimed that you didnt say something, when you clearly did, and I did the lazy method of saying you did, instead of proving it to you by showing you exactly where you actually said it.

You've pretty clearly misquoted me purposely in the past, and went silent when that was pointed out.

Whatever your reasoning is, take it to PMs because you're not going to stay on topic here.

[keyburz]

Im pretty sure I've been anything but silent with you. To the point where you wanted me to stop talking to you.

So I did.

You kept going after claiming you blocked me. It's not a one way street, lady.

[Mindy_Macready]

Im pretty sure I've been anything but silent with you. To the point where you wanted me to stop talking to you.

So I did.

You kept going after claiming you blocked me. It's not a one way street, lady.

Could you stop de-railing threads?

[keyburz]

Could you stop de-railing threads?

I'm going to defend myself thank you. This isnt going to be some childish game of you getting to say whatever you want and I have no right to defend myself.

Or maybe youre saying that because i'm disagreeing with what you're saying. Disagreeing with you does not equal derail.

[Mindy_Macready]

I'm going to defend myself thank you. This isnt going to be some childish game of you getting to say whatever you want and I have no right to defend myself.

Or maybe youre saying that because i'm disagreeing with what you're saying. Disagreeing with you does not equal derail.

Plenty of people have disagreed with me. Plenty of people have stayed on topic. For some reason you can't seem to do that.

Plenty of people aren't as sensitive as you, who for some reason just can't comprehend what the discussion is about, yet feel the need to have the last word.

[Caitlinzulu]

And another thread bites the dust :P

[Mindy_Macready]

Any ways...

I really think the next set of potions, whenever they're introduced, needs to follow the old x-potions of <main stat> pattern. Increasing yield is a must, there's no question about that. I wouldn't even mind if the mats cost a lot. But they need to be viable by not being a completely time sink to craft a stack of them.

[Roth_Trailfinder]

Crafting any level 60 starred items takes a while, unless you are happy with NQ.

[Sollux]

Difficulty is in no way the defining factor to why max pots aren't as plentiful as x-pots. The reason behind their unpopularity is because of a domino effect of issues:

1. Regardless of whether anyone is still pushing server first, this is still a period where a good number of players are taking a break and waiting for 3.3. Sheer loss of player count limits your potential market, not to mention the number of Gatherers able to stock the market with mats and lower the cost of the final product.

2. Any group serious enough to still be pushing for a server first likely has a private Crafter/seller making them pots so you're not going to see them on the market, but they'll be buying up the mats (likely in large quantities).

3. Because of the reduced demand sales are much slower. A profit is a profit, but most players want a quick, reliable sale, regardless of the margins.

4. Slower sales means mats are less plentiful for the same reason as #3, Gatherers prefer a quick, reliable sale.

5. Because of the above reasons ALC Specialist has very few options for gil generation compared to other classes and is subsequently chosen much less often.

When you combine all of the above reasons you get a market where the mats to make the potions are high cost or nonexistent due to low demand/low active population, which forces a Crafter to charge more for the final product, which in turn lowers the frequency of sales due to the high price, which decreases interest in ALC Specialist due to poor gil generation potential, which decreases the competition in said market allowing someone to easily monopolize it and charge even higher prices (if they so choose) which can also lower demand even further and you're left with a small number of high cost high use potions that very few people are willing to pay for.

Rather than the difficulty being the problem, I'd say it's the output, and this is something they've already said they're going to address. More pots per Craft means Crafters can charge 1/3 the price per pot and still retain the same profit margins even if mats stayed the same price, which they won't (not for long anyways) because a lower price equates to more sales, making it more profitable for a Gatherer to Gather and sell the mats. This lowers the mat cost due to increased competition in the mat market and will in turn lower the final product cost even further, which makes them even more appealing not only to buyers but also to other Crafters who may pick up ALC Specialist to join the max pot market, which in turn lowers the price AGAIN due to the new competition.

[Mindy_Macready]

1. X-pots still sell frequently. If there were truly a raid lull this wouldn't happen, because they wouldn't be needed.

2. Yes, which means less marketboard activity, because nobody with a social life is going to craft these without an agreement beforehand due to the time sink involved in crafting, mainly due to the yield AND difficulty in the recipes. If you're having to use Maker's Mark on every craft, your free time for other activities (i.e. raiding) will go down significantly, especially if you're counted on to provide the potions for your raid.

3/4. There's no reduced demand for pots. People still buy x-pots all the time

5. ALC should be renamed "Orchestrion Sheet Printer" at this point :\

If they're going to limit these recipes to ALC specialists, they need to increase the yield to make them viable, yes, but they should've followed the pattern X-pots had, where they remained merely 2-star recipes in the face of 3-star crafts being introduced at the same time.