30 Minute Lockout for Leaving Roulette's isn't Working as Intended.

[Reynhart]

There's a trope for that.

Should we credit some of the folks here in the "Real Life" section ?

[MilesSaintboroguh]

Too niche at best.

[Brian_]

Yes, people gravitates towards the least effort, but the more you ease everything, the more they ask for an easier way. That'exactly why the roulette was created, to ease tome farming. And people still complain...

Nobody is complaining about the "good" dungeons / trials / guildhests from their roulette.

So, to avoid a potentially 40 minutes dungeon, they'll stay disconnected for 40 minutes ?
Real efficient !

To avoid wasting 40 minutes of their time for an awful reward, they'd rather go play another game or do something else more productive for 40 minutes. Is that something you want as a fan of this game? For people to go play another game? Because that's what punishment does. It forces people away. Why would they deal with getting punished in this game when they can go have fun and be rewarded in another?

Nothing is fun about punishment.

So what ? We should feel sorry for those who don't want to finish a dungeon and just leave you there because the last part is not Xp efficient ? We should feel sorry for those who leave a 24-man raid when a boss doesn't drop the one thing they want or they just lose the roll ?
And what should we say to those penalized by that ? "Deal with it" ?

No, I am saying that rather than bad ideas, empty rhetoric, and demagoguing, that we should look at the problem from a rational and logical perspective rather than one filled with spite.

What collateral damage ? If you take a penalty when purposely withdrawing or staying AFK for so long that the duty automatically kicks you out, how can you end up being a "collateral" damage ?

The collateral damage is the many people who genuinely need to leave a duty. It might be an emergency. It might be an unstable internet connection. There will be innocent people who are impacted by harsher leaver penalties.

Of course they don't, since it costs them nothing apart from a little slap on the wrist. It's like in real life, If all you risk by breaking a rule is "Oh, that's not nice", then you'll just break it all the time.

I hate to make this political but your stance has been proven wrong in reality and in practice time and time again. The war on drugs is not working. The mass incarceration culture is not working. The police state is not working. Meanwhile you have numerous credible studies about the far better impact and effectiveness of positive reinforcement and rehabilitation. But no, you're a bitter, spiteful, petty little man who is more concerned with punishing people than the health of the game.

[Reynhart]

No, I am saying that rather than bad ideas, empty rhetoric, and demagoguing, that we should look at the problem from a rational and logical perspective rather than one filled with spite.

People are jerks, there's your problem.

It might be an emergency.

If you have an emergency, your biggest concern will be "Oh, shoot, I took a penalty from the Duty Finder" ? Seriously ?

It might be an unstable internet connection.

Losing connexion doesn't put you out of a duty. Being kicked doesn't give you any penalty. Have you read what I wrote ?

I hate to make this political but your stance has been proven wrong in reality and in practice time and time again.

Yeah, because video games are just like reality, right ? When was the last time you were banned of real life for making fake money ? When was the last time you were kicked out of the mall for idling too much ?

[Brian_]

People are jerks, there's your problem.

I highly doubt the majority of droppers are doing it just to troll. They're doing it for practical reasons. As such, there is an equally pragmatic solution. And, it's not punishing them.

But you are just proving my point. Your perspective is that these people are jerks so you have to retaliate. That's not how you fix a problem. An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind, two wrongs don't make a right, etc.

If you have an emergency, your biggest concern will be "Oh, shoot, I took a penalty from the Duty Finder" ? Seriously ?

Losing connexion doesn't put you out of a duty. Being kicked doesn't give you any penalty. Have you read what I wrote ?

The point is that when someone has an emergency, it doesn't need to be some life altering disaster. And, it might not even take 30 minutes to deal with (or however long you're proposing to extend the penalty to). Sometimes I will get a work related phone call. I would rather drop group than force them to wait an indefinite amount of time. Maybe the phone call is 5 minutes. Maybe it turns into a series of phone calls that lasts a few hours. As for the connection issues, sometimes when you zone in you will notice yourself spiking or repeatedly disconnecting. Many will just apologize and drop group so that they can find someone else. Why should that group need to wait to vote kick just to avoid the penalty?

Are you seriously arguing that there is never a genuine situation where a person has to drop group?

[Reynhart]

Are you seriously arguing that there is never a genuine situation where a person has to drop group?

It's funny how many "genuine situation" seem to happen right at the start of the dungeon...and not after several minutes where you could kick the person right away if he does not come back or even said anything.
You know, something like "Sorry, phone". You know what might happen if you say this ? People could go on without you for trash mobs and even wait a little before engaging the boss to give you time to finish your call.

Besides, what I suggested would only apply when you quit a roulette, not just any duty. So your genuine situation is when you have an emergency, right from the start of the roulette, without having anytime to say "Sorry, problem", yet still not important enough so that you'd still get concerned by being punished in the game.

However, I admit that you should be able to do an abandon vote without any time restriction, for situations where you cannot continue the Duty right from the beginning.

[Camate]

Greetings,

Thank you for the feedback you've been offering in regards to the penalty for leaving duties. I'd like to give you some insight into how the current penalty was decided.

The current penalty was set with the following circumstances in mind:

• Users abandoning a duty continuously while trying to get placed into a specific duty
• Users leaving a duty because of emergency situations that arose outside of the game

While we don't currently have any plans to adjust the penalty, we want to continue to gather your feedback on the topic so we can let the dev. team know your thoughts on the situation. With that said, please continue to keep your feedback coming on this topic!

[KariArisu]

The current penalty is fine. The real issue is how long it can take to get a party started, or replace a leaver.

There's a serious lack of tanks, always. Healers are also lacking but not as badly. The incentive for being an "Adventurer in Need" needs buffed significantly. Gil is worthless.
There's also NO WAY to know a party in progress needs a replacement, without queuing for them.

[Ashkendor]

A big problem with the shortage of tanks/healers is how wonky the queue system is. I've had many FC members and other acquaintances ask for a tank/heal to JIP, but then when I try to jump in and help them out, I'll get shunted into a brand new run instead. I honestly think in-progress runs should take precedence over new runs even if the new runs are technically before them in the queue. The in-progress run has one or more people that already have time invested into it, plus it has a hard time limit on it.

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

If someone is being rude, talking more than healing/dps'ing/tank cooldowns, I will vote kick them. They are impeding the run. If that fails to go through, I will leave on my own. I refuse to spend 40 minutes in a dungeon that can be run in 20, just because someone else is dragging their feet and being a chatty cathy.

That has to be the least efficient way to do roulettes ever.