People are deliberately ruining the story for others

[Niwashi]

Man, you are thick. As mentioned before, their is a compromise that generally happens in Praetorium and CM. New players get to watch their CSs, although they miss out on fights, and experienced players get their tomes, at the expense of having to carry a person through an otherwise useless dungeon. Is it perfect? Nope! But SE made some bad decisions early on, and so that is simply the best situation most groups can hope for.

It's not a compromise for one side to get everything they want and the other to be totally locked out of ever getting what they want. No matter how often you try calling it that does't make it one. You're saying that new players, or any players for that matter, should never be able to see the story. The climax of ARR should never happen at all. That's not a compromise solution. It's a total lockout of a major goal of the game. And trying to claim that just getting to see a few disjointed meaningless snippets (that still don't let you see what the story is, but do give a few clues about some pieces of it) should compensate for that goal is total bullshit.

And that it's done for something as trivial as not wanting to wait a few minutes makes it worse. It's not like anyone's challenging your right to get your tome rewards. If the delay were longer or the dungeon time limit shorter, so that watching the cutscenes meant not getting to complete, then we'd have a situation that needs a compromise. As long as doing both is possible, then doing both is the only fair way of handling multiple goals.

I do agree that SE made some bad decisions on the design of these two dungeons, but that's why I want them to fix that.

[Skivvy]

It's not a compromise for one side to get everything they want and the other to be totally locked out of ever getting what they want. No matter how often you try calling it that does't make it one. You're saying that new players, or any players for that matter, should never be able to see the story. The climax of ARR should never happen at all. That's not a compromise solution. It's a total lockout of a major goal of the game. And trying to claim that just getting to see a few disjointed meaningless snippets (that still don't let you see what the story is, but do give a few clues about some pieces of it) should compensate for that goal is total bullshit.

And that it's done for something as trivial as not wanting to wait a few minutes makes it worse. It's not like anyone's challenging your right to get your tome rewards. If the delay were longer or the dungeon time limit shorter, so that watching the cutscenes meant not getting to complete, then we'd have a situation that needs a compromise. As long as doing both is possible, then doing both is the only fair way of handling multiple goals.

I do agree that SE made some bad decisions on the design of these two dungeons, but that's why I want them to fix that.

Show me where I said that new players, or any players, should never be able to see the story. PLEASE. SHOW ME. New players are more than welcome to go back to those dungeons and experience the fights themselves if they missed them due to watching CSs, if they are so inclined.

For your enlightenment only, I would love to see these dungeons removed from the roulette system entirely. Then you can see how truly awful it would be for new players to get through the ARR dungeons.

Anyway, I'm tapping out here as there is nothing more to be said.

[Ashkendor]

And that it's done for something as trivial as not wanting to wait a few minutes makes it worse.

You keep trying to trivialize the time investment; Praetorium alone has 20-30 minutes of cutscenes.

I do agree that SE made some bad decisions on the design of these two dungeons, but that's why I want them to fix that.

Given that the content is nearly three years old, I think this is a pipe dream. I know the devs made some mention of doing something with the 2.x and 3.x story going into 4.0 so that people didn't have so much to catch up on for the game's second expansion; perhaps they have plans to deal with it at that point? We don't have any way of knowing. Honestly, when I first did these dungeons I insisted on watching the cutscenes, which meant I missed some of the boss fights. It was a bit upsetting at the time, but in retrospect it was a very minor thing and I've long since moved past it.

[Kaurie]

You keep trying to trivialize the time investment; Praetorium alone has 20-30 minutes of cutscenes.

According to this youtube video entitled "Praetorium All Cut-Scenes" it is 35:28. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VPLbImc084

Given that the content is nearly three years old, I think this is a pipe dream. I know the devs made some mention of doing something with the 2.x and 3.x story going into 4.0 so that people didn't have so much to catch up on for the game's second expansion; perhaps they have plans to deal with it at that point? We don't have any way of knowing. Honestly, when I first did these dungeons I insisted on watching the cutscenes, which meant I missed some of the boss fights. It was a bit upsetting at the time, but in retrospect it was a very minor thing and I've long since moved past it.

It may be a pipe dream, but I think it is in Square's best interest to address this. I have seen 3 or 4 new threads complaining about this since Monday this week alone. There is very little the game offers pre-60 outside of story, and to have the story ruined, I imagine, would result in a lot of people quitting entirely. This could be a very significant revenue loss for Square, and adding something as simple as a warning pop up would be a relatively low cost high payout way to address the issue.