For the 129392831203123801 time. STOP IT with the genderlocked gear.

[Noxifer]

Because it's just a game and the fact that you're so serious about it is funny

It's just a game, yes. Does that mean that my gaming experience is worth less than, for example, Bladesinger's experience (the poster before you)? And where were all the people with your opinion when the huge outrage about the Gambler coat went on? People were absolutely livid that a gearset based on a canon character from a previous FF game (Setzer from FFVI) was rumoured to be male-only, while the female-only outfit was "just a playboy bunny". And yes, I was one of the people who agreed that it would not be fair if that was the case.

But once it was made clear that the Gambler gearset was going to be unisex, all outrage over the unfairness died away. That's what I find so difficult to understand. Why it's okay to be upset that male characters get something that female characters don't, but that it's 'funny' and 'laughable' when people get upset that female characters get something that male characters don't.

[BrokenFox]

It's just a game, yes. Does that mean that my gaming experience is worth less than, for example, Bladesinger's experience (the poster before you)? And where were all the people with your opinion when the huge outrage about the Gambler coat went on? People were absolutely livid that a gearset based on a canon character from a previous FF game (Setzer from FFVI) was rumoured to be male-only, while the female-only outfit was "just a playboy bunny". And yes, I was one of the people who agreed that it would not be fair if that was the case ...

Something like the Setzer outfit is a different case cause it's an iconic special set, and I agree things like that should be available to everyone regardless of what they play. Genderlocked gear in general though is not a bad thing.

[Noxifer]

No but if you make it a stuffed banana hammock that squeaks, it turns the tables into pure hilarity.

Which has nothing to do whatsoever with clothes, really.

You're taking something very simple and creating a giant deal out of it. There is gender locked gear. It is not the end of the world, your character isn't going to start being bad at DPS'ing, healing or tanking. People still love you..'mere..come on..hug it out. It's all in the hips.

No, I still keep it very simple: Female and male characters do not have equal amounts of possible glamour items. This is not fair.
Would I want all clothes to be unisex because I think some of the female-only clothes would look awesome on my au ra? Yes. I'm not going to deny that. But the very least SE could do, and what I'm primarily arguing for, is to make sure there are the same amount of options.

On top of that most of the gear you want so bad to glamour on is going to change. There have been times where I have tried to see how something looks on me, and I can't because it is gender locked to women.

It's not a form of bullying, no one is throwing out mean words to make you cry. You're complaining to complain.

No. I'm not. I'm not complaining about the sets where there are male-only and female-only equivalents, like the yukatas and swimsuit and EB outfits and NPC outfits, and yes, most of the glamour gear that was released this patch. Those are fair. While they look different, and any individual may prefer their own or the opposite set, all characters have their own set, whether it's based on gender or gender in combination with race.

The ones that are not fair are the ones where we have one set that is female-only, and nothing that is male-only. Instead, the outfit you would think was the male one has been determined to be 'unisex', effectively giving female characters two gearsets while male characters only get one.

It may not be bullying, but it is a form of discrimination.

Quit being so entitled to everything and focus on the problems that matter. Be constructive and help us get a solution to the actual glamour problem. I'm not saying it's not right or wrong, I am saying it's far from a big deal compared to other things.

Of course. It's a problem for a minority of a minority group. Does that mean there's not a problem? And 'be constructive'? There have been numerous threads where people have posted suggestions, either design-wise how to make current female-only gear unisex, or otherwise suggesting various methods to even the balance. Most threads, unfortunately, tend to degenerate into name-calling and back-and-forths. Sometimes this is based on pro-unisex people having bad arguments or otherwise being unable to express themselves clearly. But more often (based on my own observations, which I admit are limited and/or biased) it starts out because of other people coming into the thread and accusing the pro-unisex people of being transvestites, transgender, gay, sexual deviants or any other specific grouping, usually without basis and often with the connotation that belonging to any of those groups is inherently bad.

Pro-unisex: "It's not fair that female characters have more options than male characters. Please make all glamour gear unisex, SE, or at least stop with the female-only/unisex combos."
Insulter: "Men wearing dresses is immoral and wrong D: Don't force your gay agenda on us normal people."
Pro-unisex: "Who died and made you god? You can't tell me what to wear and not D: That's just sexist!"
Thread: *derailed*

Paraphrased and simplified, but that's how I've seen many threads go =/ And no, I'm not saying that the fault lies purely on one side. But it's difficult to get back to a sensible discussion once something like that has happened.

You may be tired of these threads, but so are we. We're tired of trying to bring constructive criticism to the forum mods, having our threads derailed for whatever reason, and subsequently locked or buried. We've gotten a response, yes, stating that they were planning on bringing in more gender-locking equality. This was shortly before 3.0, I believe, and while I can understand that designs take time and bureaucracy within a company takes time in making the decisions to alter design decisions, it was still a disappointment to see the same old female/unisex combo for the Thavnairian outfits.

3.1 had fairly ok glamour balance, aside from the Scion outfits and... another bunny outfit, with the desired bent ears. So for many of us pro-unisex people it was a slap in the face. They'd told us that things like headgear and gloves and boots would definitely be considered made unisex, but there we were, another set of bunny ears for female characters, and nothing for male characters. So it seemed that SE would much rather listen to players of female characters than players of male characters (generally speaking; there's some overlap in the unisex argument).

3.2 - again, pretty good glamour balance, with one male, one female, one unisex. Awesome. In much what had been asked for. Except... a pair of gloves (and their dyable version) being made female-only, and no gloves for the male-only set. A pair of gloves. And not particularly "feminine" gloves, either.

Something like the Setzer outfit is a different case cause it's an iconic special set, and I agree things like that should be available to everyone regardless of what they play. Genderlocked gear in general though is not a bad thing.

Yes, which was why many of those of us tired of the constant "female-only/unisex" trend spoke up, saying it wouldn't be fair. Not unless the female-only costume was also based on a character from a previous FF game.
(And if you still think a Setzer outfit should be available to all characters, even if the female-only was, say, Celes' outfit from the same game, then I'm sure you'd agree that the Celes costume should be available for male characters too, right? ^_~)

And no, in general it's not bad, unless said genderlocking continuously keeps favouring one gender over the other. Which it has here in FFXIV. So while yes, a single pair of gloves being genderlocked (beyond the balanced gear in patch 3.2) normally wouldn't be an issue, it becomes more of an issue when it's part of a bigger pattern.


TL;DR - This post became a lot longer than I first intended to, but it is a topic I care about a lot.

I don't agree that, "It's what the world looks like today, live with it," is a good argument. And just because there are larger and more important issues, "What about the children in Africa? D:" doesn't make a good argument either. A small problem is still a problem, and can probably be fixed a lot easier than many of the larger ones.

[Leigaon]

Which has nothing to do whatsoever with clothes, really...

It's all about the banana hammock!

Some things in this game can/should be made for both sexes. They're not, but with all the other options out there, I'm sure people find something much better or equal to what they wanted. You're taking the word that has a heavy meaning to it and applying it to a video game.

You are not being discriminated against. This isn't unjust. This is a video game. They have an understanding of the difference, but somewhere down the line it was decided to make things unisex or not. Now why? Who knows. I'm not going to give them excuses, but think of more of the business aspect of it rather than the flaming crosses of hate you seem to be so sure of.

I know that no all pro-unisex are gay, transgender. Then again not all the "insulters" are straight religious people. I'm bi-sexual, and I am here playing the role of the insulter. Telling you that it is okay.

You are right with some things but you're going at it entirely wrong.

But you know what...much like the hate and anger that we've gotten in the real world along with how your tone has made it. I'm going to walk away, because it's 5 and quitting time..and you can waste your time now and energy arguing..being angry..or feeling discriminated against. It's exhausting.

There is no injustice here. There is only people who have never won a battle that are desperately trying to win one. I guess every bit helps. Now if you'll excuse me..I'm going to clock out, hit the gym and amazon myself a nice banana hammock. Fight the good fight my friend, I hope you pro-all-stuff get what you want next patch.

It's Friday and payday..time to smile!

Had to edit b/c this guy just won the thread! We can close it now!

at first i thought these threads were legitimate and made decent points. Mostly that a lot of the "male" sets were unisex
but lately these posts just come off as "LOOK AT ME I'M AN ACTIVIST FOR EQUALITY"

If everything was the same for everyone all the time the world would be a boring place.
Look at the bright side, if you want to be a dude wearing a belly dancer outfit you can do that in real life all you want and no one will stop you

[Noxifer]

Some things in this game can/should be made for both sexes. They're not, but with all the other options out there, I'm sure people find something much better or equal to what they wanted. You're taking the word that has a heavy meaning to it and applying it to a video game.

You are not being discriminated against. This isn't unjust. This is a video game.

In a way it is. It may not be gender discrimination (as we see it IRL), and it may not be as serious as IRL discrimination, but you are given fewer options based on the gender of your character.

but think of more of the business aspect of it rather than the flaming crosses of hate you seem to be so sure of.

Never said anything about flaming crosses of hate or anything to that effect. I know it's mainly a business decision, same as their initial decision to make the EB ceremony strictly male-female. Due to the backlash of that, they changed said decision. If people hadn't spoken up about it, would it have been changed? Most likely not.

Generally, feedback is there to tell the people in charge what you're unhappy about. If no feedback is given about something, the people in charge are usually going to assume that everything is fine with it. So yes, call it 'entitlement' if you will, but the forums are there to allow people to give feedback and make requests. (Yes, I'm calling it requests, even though 'request' threads in general are often phrased and titled as demands.) The players do have the right to post and try to get the devs' attention. The devs also have the right to ignore any and all players they choose to ignore, I'm not saying they don't. But being ignored isn't a cease and desist either; people can continue to try to get attention and 'prove' that their issue is one that other people feel the same about. The more people that agree, the better, no?

I know that no all pro-unisex are gay, transgender. Then again not all the "insulters" are straight religious people. I'm bi-sexual, and I am here playing the role of the insulter. Telling you that it is okay.

And I know that not everyone against it are straight, religious people. I'm also well aware that not everyone against it is arguing through insults. I have nothing against civil and constructive arguments, it's just when they start out with name-calling, or make it obvious they didn't even read the first post (by claiming something completely irrelevant to the actual topic, like "men in dresses is wrong" when the topic is "genderlock balance") that I come close to headdesking ^^;

But you know what...much like the hate and anger that we've gotten in the real world along with how your tone has made it.

I do apologize if my tone has appeared in any way antagonistic or zealous. Yes, I am passionate about the subject, but I'm trying (and from what I can tell, mostly succeeding) in keeping a calm and fairly logical tone. Sure, my logic may be flawed from an outside perspective, or it may at least seem to be, but... I'm not just throwing stuff out without thinking about it. Nor do I do so with any intention of arguing just for the sake of arguing. I'm not good at the whole 'reading between lines' thing, so when I (for example) ask for clarification on something, nine times out of ten it's because I'm genuinely curious or puzzled as to the answer to my question.

There is no injustice here. There is only people who have never won a battle that are desperately trying to win one. I guess every bit helps. Now if you'll excuse me..I'm going to clock out, hit the gym and amazon myself a nice banana hammock. Fight the good fight my friend, I hope you pro-all-stuff get what you want next patch.

In your eyes, there might not be any injustice. But in other people's eyes, the glamour balance is unfair. It's better now than it's been before, yes. But maybe it's precisely because we don't want to risk going back to the 2.x imbalance that we're bringing up seemingly inconsequential issues like "female characters get one pair of gloves more than us". =)

at first i thought these threads were legitimate and made decent points. Mostly that a lot of the "male" sets were unisex
but lately these posts just come off as "LOOK AT ME I'M AN ACTIVIST FOR EQUALITY"

If everything was the same for everyone all the time the world would be a boring place.
Look at the bright side, if you want to be a dude wearing a belly dancer outfit you can do that in real life all you want and no one will stop you

So the argument that female/unisex is unfair is less valid now? Because it's been made before? But while I agree that the last two patches have been better with regards to that than 2.0-3.0, that's one of the verbs that really should be conjugated "better, good, best", at least in some contexts.
Yes, many posts tend to come off as "look, it's me again, chanting the same old thing!" but... it's really tricky to monologue for a long time without sounding like that. And without much of a dialogue with SE (apart from vague 'we're considering maybe changing some things' and 'please look forward to it!'), a monologue is pretty much what it is =/

Honestly, I just want male/female equivalents on gear releases. Either have one set with two corresponding model tweaks (like how certain gear sets will change depending on sex), or when a themed set gets released, something for male and something for female. Gender locks are fine, if everyone gets something, not the unisex/female BS.

Pretty much my opinion, yes =)