Paladin adjustments = PALLY BUFFS!

[Jpec07]

Wohooo! Not like I think PLD needed that much of a change I main DRK but pref PLD over Thordan and Ravana EX.

Just to put it in perspective: Paladins currently have the worst MT DPS by a large margin, and also bring the least to the table from a mitigation perspective - Parry is actually made worse by a high block rate shield. We generate the least enmity, completely lack any kind of reliable AoE (which is funny because the extra mitigation our shield provides only works against large packs of mobs), our DoT is hidden at the end of a 3-move combo, we have no way to manage our TP (I've found myself running on fumes by the end of almost every FATE I've done for the relic), and our "utility" moves are clumsy and disproportionately hard to use effectively.

Still, really pumped for this. It seems like they've actually been listening, and that feels really good.

Wonder what it will be changed? I'm guessing something to do with Clemency like a Cast time reduce to 2 or something.

I don't think the cast timer is the problem so much as the fact that it's so easy to interrupt. There has been some consensus on the forums concerning what changes would help the job, and they range from extremely simple to extremely complex. I just hope that they get it right. DRK and WAR are both in very good spots--it would be fantastic if Paladin was given enough improvement and utility to close the gap.

I wonder what they'll do to DRK and WAR? It says PLD adjustments will be big but it specifically says all tanks here, I wonder what changes we'll see?

I'd guess DRK may see a change to Living Dead to give it greater synergy with the increased HP pools the Vit-Str conversion is going to give them. Might also see a buff to non-DA C&S, or some way to manage MP while stuck in those phases of combat where you can't attack anything (without dropping Darkside).

Warriors are going to be nerfed, I'm guessing. Their axes will be replaced with pillows, and Fel Cleave will be replaced with Fel Cuddle.

[SpookyGhost]

and also bring the least to the table from a mitigation perspective - Parry is actually made worse by a high block rate shield.

While it's true that having high block rate results in Parry, as a secondary stat, being worse, the best shields now are Towers due to Sheltron and (to an extent) Bulwark. On top of this, block is 1-9% more powerful than Parry atm so if you could've parried instead of blocked, it was better to block anyway. PLD, mitigation-wise, is fine - it only suffers slightly in magic fights compared to the other two. It's biggest problem is the lack of DPS, which is being addressed.

[Jpec07]

While it's true that having high block rate results in Parry, as a secondary stat, being worse, the best shields now are Towers due to Sheltron and (to an extent) Bulwark. On top of this, block is 1-9% more powerful than Parry atm so if you could've parried instead of blocked, it was better to block anyway. PLD, mitigation-wise, is fine - it only suffers slightly in magic fights compared to the other two. It's biggest problem is the lack of DPS, which is being addressed.

I forget where it was (though I think it was somewhere here), where someone mapped out the mitigation available through cooldowns and passive attributes to the three tanks, and found that Paladins mathematically actually have the worst mitigation options of the three - and to my knowledge, it's been this way since the Warrior buffs of 2.x. And that just sits funny with me when I remember Yoshi talking about Paladins as supposedly the most defensive tank, and the tank who takes the least damage. Maybe if they sit there and spam Stoneskin between each combo that's true, but that's an awfully specific circumstance.

[SpookyGhost]

*post*

It depends on how the fight is paced, how many hits the tank busters are, whether there's cleaves or not, etc. but basically Sheltron destroys that argument for any fight that isn't magic based (so, unfortunately, just A3S, Thordan EX, and Ravana EX atm). Not only is it ~29% damage reduction, it can be stacked with other CDs - obviously not additively but I think the only equivalent of Sheltron + Sentinel is DA + DM + Shadow Wall + Reprisal, and I'm not sure if that even adds up to enough. On top of this, an advantage of both DRK and PLD is that their short-CD-high-damage-reduction abilities are available out of their tank stances, unlike WAR which needs Defiance for IB. I think WAR might have the most overall mitigation in a given fight if using tank stance, but DRK/PLD have the highest burst mitigation rotation available to them with or without their tank stances. PLD also uniquely has Divine Veil, though that hasn't really needed utilizing yet.

[Jpec07]

*SpookyPost*

Aha, that's what I hadn't considered. Burst mitigation is definitely the name of the game here, especially considering most of the mitigation tanks have to do in raids revolves around big, single hits (or intermittent periods of heavy incoming damage).

I will also admit, I hope they keep inflated tank HP in mind when designing the next encounters. We'll be walking in with 20k (if we've prepared), which could make some mechanics hurt a lot less than they otherwise might.

[Donjo]

Warriors are going to be nerfed, I'm guessing. Their axes will be replaced with pillows, and Fel Cleave will be replaced with Fel Cuddle.

Nerf or not, I'd pay to be able to keep enmity by cuddling enemies. :3

[Reaver_Bharash]

Warriors are going to be nerfed, I'm guessing. Their axes will be replaced with pillows, and Fell Cleave will be replaced with Fell Cuddle.

As a WAR main I was almost offended...but then I laughed my ass off.

To add to it...

Berserk = Pillow Fight
Bloodbath = Flowerbath

LMAO

[Ashkendor]

As a WAR main I was almost offended...but then I laughed my ass off.

To add to it...

Berserk = Pillow Fight
Bloodbath = Flowerbath

LMAO

Does Pillow Fight get a buff if you're glamoured in a bikini/lingerie, I wonder? :3

[AlexiIvaniskavich]

Warriors are going to be nerfed, I'm guessing. Their axes will be replaced with pillows, and Fel Cleave will be replaced with Fel Cuddle.

And then there will be me, buying my co-tank a fantasia and forcing him to re-roll as a lala.....


I still expect PLD to finish 3rd while in tank stance, just not so horrifically far behind.

[Shurrikhan]

I'd guess DRK may see a change to Living Dead to give it greater synergy with the increased HP pools the Vit-Str conversion is going to give them. Might also see a buff to non-DA C&S, or some way to manage MP while stuck in those phases of combat where you can't attack anything (without dropping Darkside).

Fell Cleave -> Fell Cuddle...

Would be nice to not have to pay a now-4k higher amount of healing to take Doom off for what may about to preventing only 2k overkill. Personally, I'd rather they're just allowed to have negative HP, and need only be healed back to a positive value, but if they were to take more than max health damage during that time that would be a mitigation loss, and coding problems would probably prevent that anyways... Never fun having the debuff component of something increased just because your stats improved.

Honestly hope WAR's aren't nerfed much, if at all. I'd be cool with seeing Fell Cleave drop from 500 to 440-460 and Decimate from 280 to 250-260, but only if Defiance (and Convalesce and Mantra) is going to be allowed to affect healing abilities (WAR-specific self-heals scaled to have similar values), etc. Generally, I'd just like to see the other tanks moved closer to WAR in terms of synergy and usability improvements, rather than WAR being nerfed.