So nobody is worried that we might cause [spoilers]

[Cilia]

Then we have the Gerun Oracles. If it follows FFXII; so some clod (or clods) are dictating how pivotal moments in history are gonna go down to achieve a "desired end" or prevent an "end in ruin".
Alright, who is this pretentious, "immortal" idiot, and where is he? He needs a beating.

My current best guess is that it's Zodiark / the Ascians.

The Echo, the "power to overcome," allows us to overcome Zodiark's curse and rewrite fate. The Ascians also have it, but use it to the opposite end - keeping fate on course. There seems to be a big problem with Hydaelyn's actions; she seems to be violating causality and fate by allowing our existence, while we seem to be the only one the Ascians pay any real attention to. Ol' Elidibus also seems intent on getting Urianger to buy into his "this was all written" philosophy, but the latter is intent on fighting "our fate to perish."

Well, time will tell the big answers.

[Fenral]

Ol' Elidibus also seems intent on getting Urianger to buy into his "this was all written" philosophy, but the latter is intent on fighting "our fate to perish."

And I still say you have it backwards: Eldibus is trying to show Urianger that there's a fate in need of fighting, not that he should give in and accept destiny. It's of course tempting to believe that we're already on the "fighting fate" side, because JRPG heroes usually are, but I don't think we have any tangible indicator of that, yet.

As for me, I'm presently inclined to think of events like the Ultima Weapon fight as a sign that Hydaelyn is ensuring our destiny by directly intervening in situations that jeopardize Her plans for us. "Destiny" is ultimately just a conceit used to describe the unseen authorial intent behind the universe. The problem is figuring out who's writing what.

[Kaiser-Ace]

And I still say you have it backwards: Eldibus is trying to show Urianger that there's a fate in need of fighting, not that he should give in and accept destiny. It's of course tempting to believe that we're already on the "fighting fate" side, because JRPG heroes usually are, but I don't think we have any tangible indicator of that, yet.

Eludibus can hardly count for all Asian ideals. Nebralius was trying to send EVERYTHING back to oblivion, Zodiark included. And Lahabrea by the time of his demise seemed hell bent of destroying us, plans and consequences be damned.

I still champion the idea that Elidibus is on his own scheme and that the Ascians are a lose coalition at best that (occasionally) share the same end goal. But they are hardly a unified front.

[CyrilLucifer]

And I still say you have it backwards: Eldibus is trying to show Urianger that there's a fate in need of fighting, not that he should give in and accept destiny.

I agree with Fenral, I still say it's the Ascians who fight fate while those who serve the Light unintentionally ensure the continued path.

Allow me to step out of in-game defense here for a moment and discuss a meta topic.
Ascians seek chaos. What does chaos tend to represent, even outside of D&D in Japanese games? Freedom of choice an independent action, which Elidibus is all for - telling Nabriales that they all serve, in their own way. It is by exploiting the Spoken races and their natural tendency towards chaos (Ramuh says darkness, but the implication is the same, darkness causing chaos) that they are able to pursue their goals. I just find it a bit hard to see them flipping to the opposite end of this spectrum.
Respectively, we have an example with Thordan of Light being used to represent the ultimate order.

Also, I'm with Kaiser. We know that all of the Ascians do not share the same methods and disagreements seem somewhat frequent in how events should proceed, which was the entire point of the Nabriales and Elidibus scene in 2.1. What we don't know is how united they are other than being under a banner of the same overall goal. As an extreme example for comparison, you can equally say Thordan and the WoL can be placed under a banner of wanting to banish darkness and creating a world of light. Seems a bit extreme when you put it that way. It's just too vague to really make assumptions that they are all in perfect harmony, unison, and agreement on all matters about everything just because they work for the same master. In fact, we straight up have evidence implying otherwise.

[Cilia]

And I still say you have it backwards: Eldibus is trying to show Urianger that there's a fate in need of fighting, not that he should give in and accept destiny. It's of course tempting to believe that we're already on the "fighting fate" side, because JRPG heroes usually are, but I don't think we have any tangible indicator of that, yet.

As for me, I'm presently inclined to think of events like the Ultima Weapon fight as a sign that Hydaelyn is ensuring our destiny by directly intervening in situations that jeopardize Her plans for us. "Destiny" is ultimately just a conceit used to describe the unseen authorial intent behind the universe. The problem is figuring out who's writing what.

Until we really get more from Elidibus and Urianger, it's hard to say what exactly is in The Gerun Oracles beyond that it foretells fate and Elidibus believes it's correct. The full quote of Urianger's small talk, though is:

Tataru hath told me all. Thou hast prevailed over the Ascians, and so avenged Moenbryda. "Knowledge dictates expectation, and expectation colors perception." On occasion, truth may issue from the mouths of fiends and foes. Our knowledge is dwarfed by our ignorance, and what wisdom we possess hath been distorted by the passage of time. But no matter how distorted our wisdom becometh, may it never be forgot that man is the master of his own destiny. The final verse of the Divine Chronicles fortelleth the destruction of the world. But if it is our fate to perish, so too is it our fate to fight. So let us fight on, as ever we have, in the hopes that the dawn's light will shine again and forevermore.

Doesn't sound to me like he's intent on following Hydaelyn's spelled-out doom. Rather, combined with this year's page from Louisoix's journal, it seems to me that Zodiark cast a curse of doom on Hydaelyn out of hatred for some reason, which is the reason for the repeated Calamities that are trying to end the world - and each time she rebuffs the curse (though Echo users), it weakens her, which is the reason behind the gradual weakening of her blessing through the ages. Doubtless whenever she performs a divine intervention she's ensuring the path she wants us to follow - but if Zodiark's curse is the inevitable doom of the world, and Hydaelyn's aim is to delay or prevent that... I'll go with the goddess who doesn't want me to die.

The problem then becomes the fact that, despite her desire to let us live, she's shackling us (at least us, the Warrior of Light) to her own written fate, making Hydaelyn kind of hypocritical. This is the problem with dealing with gods - they all have their own objective and no qualms manipulating whoever they need to achieve that objective. We are Hydaelyn's "beloved daughter/son," but despite that we're functionally little more than a piece in her game against Zodiark. An important piece, but just a piece nonetheless.

... of course, if man is the master of his own destiny, and he declares his fate is to challenge his fate, can such a thing as fate be said to exist? Clearly Elidibus thinks so, pulling out his book of foretold fate to tell Urianger this is what our fates are, and with your preordained fate known you can either A) play your part or B) rebel against it. As noted above in his own dialogue, Urianger seems intent on deciding his own destiny at least. If it's our fate to die then it's our fate to fight that death... so is there any rebellion to be made?

Gah, all this talk of fate is getting me confuzzled. I'm gonna go do a FATE to get my thoughts in order.

[CyrilLucifer]

The problem then becomes the fact that, despite her desire to let us live, she's shackling us (at least us, the Warrior of Light) to her own written fate, making Hydaelyn kind of hypocritical. This is the problem with dealing with gods - they all have their own objective and no qualms manipulating whoever they need to achieve that objective. We are Hydaelyn's "beloved daughter/son," but despite that we're functionally little more than a piece in her game against Zodiark. An important piece, but just a piece nonetheless.

I think this can be assumed either way, no matter which side of the equation is dealing with "fate." We are a tool, Her weapon against the darkness. A beloved weapon, a weapon to keep oiled and sharp, but still one tool of many.

I believe everyone, including our character, knows it. So, even if Hydaelyn is fighting for freedom and against some horrible prophecized fate, so to speak, we are still bound to our fate of servitude, aiding her. Which comes with some perks, yes, but it takes its toll.

[Fenral]

Until we really get more from Elidibus and Urianger, it's hard to say what exactly is in The Gerun Oracles beyond that it foretells fate and Elidibus believes it's correct.

He believes it is "correct," not that it is "right." It's simply a matter of how you take the rest of what he says. If "all of this has been ordained," then that means that nothing we've done so far has actually run counter to the prophesied end. All of the "fate fighting" we think we've been doing has actually been part of the plan all along, moving us ever closer to the precipice.

Maybe.

[Cilia]

He believes it is "correct," not that it is "right." It's simply a matter of how you take the rest of what he says. If "all of this has been ordained," then that means that nothing we've done so far has actually run counter to the prophesied end. All of the "fate fighting" we think we've been doing has actually been part of the plan all along, moving us ever closer to the precipice.

Maybe.

Elidibus actually hasn't given his thoughts on whether the Gerun Oracles is right or not. All he says is that...

It is a truth long forgotten - a tale of the beginning, and of the path we have been set upon. Our fates were ordained long ago, Archon. The Garleans are no exepction. Nor the Triad. You know what must be done.

Not really sure how to take this beyond Elidibus saying, paraphrased, "See? Our fates are spelled out, it's all here in this book. Everything that has happened and will happen... it was all written. You know your part now - all there is to do is go play it."

... then again, knowledge dictates expectation, and expectation colors perception, so knowing that JRPGs usually have the heroes challenging a foretold fate I'm pretty inclined to see it that way. Elidibus could be telling Urianger how to challenge Hydaelyn's written fate... er, the fate Hydaelyn writ for us... but if she's the benevolent, all-loving goddess we've been led to believe, we have little reason to rebel against her.

Again, it raises the problem of Hydaelyn's blessing protecting us vs. Zodiark's curse being our doom; either way we're just a puny mortal without control over our fate. But hey, that's okay! I guess! (Since, y'know, the Allagans' lack of spirituality contributed to their societal collapse...)

Perhaps nothing we've done has challenged what's written in the Oracles. Perhaps even trying is an exercise in futility. Even so...