The arrogance of some people

[RickXRolled]

Back in school there was always one kid picked last for group sports. That kid grew up to be the healer that doesn't dps.

[Eothas]

I can't speak for everyone, but if I'm saving mana for later heals then its for good reason.

This is a valid reason to not DPS in some situations, but I think no one here is talking about these situations, we are talking about when the healer have room to DPS and mana to spare. I think this is a matter of controling your mana pool too, if you can end the fight with 5% of mana but contributed with raid DPS, it's better than finish the raid with 50% mana left unused.

If we are gonna be picky, then one can say that he will not DPS, because he may die to avoidable AoE while casting stone III... that's not the point.

then that dps is lazy for not using their ability to heal when its available to them.

Hmm no. A DPS is losing time casting a healing spell, losing precious raid DPS that can turn into a wipe. A healer casting DPS skills while keeping everyone alive is actively contributing to the party. It's not equivalent. If you are talking about a SMN using rez, then I can agree, because it's saving healer's mana and helping the overall raid DPS.

[Kurogaea]

I don't even

Ugh... So like, for those who actually like his comments, state in your own words exactly what he said, because it sounds like, and I'll make it easier for you to understand:

1: Healer has heals and dps skills
2: Use both, taking advantage of both sets of skills
3: Make it easier for dps by using your dps skills as well
4: Making the choice to dps makes things easier (For others: like i said)

Keep my words intact before referencing me. If its making things easier for others, what makes it just as easy for the healer, in turn making it harder later for everyone else? As if making a choice never shared consequences. The easy way can have worse results for you, and the hard way can have less for others. DPS choose to dps instead of healing, are they making it harder for healers? That's what your saying basically.

And yes, I gave you an example before, unless that doesn't make sense to you again, in which I give up on that because you fail each time twisting others words to state a point I don't believe yourself to understand. I also don't think you understand how healers work and their mindset. I recommend actually leveling one, it might help you understand a bit better.

[Kaurie]

Ugh... So like, for those who actually like his comments, state in your own words exactly what he said, because it sounds like, and I'll make it easier for you to understand

1: Healer has heals and dps skills
2: Use both, taking advantage of both sets of skills
3: Make it easier for dps by using your dps skills as well
4: Making the choice to dps makes things easier (For others: like i said)

Keep my words intact before referencing me. If its making things easier for others, what makes it just as easy for the healer, in turn making it harder later for everyone else? As if making a choice never shared consequences. The easy way can have worse results for you, and the hard way can have less for others. DPS choose to dps instead of healing, are they making it harder for healers? That's what your saying basically.

And yes, I gave you an example before, unless that doesn't make sense to you again, in which I give up on that because you fail each time twisting others words to state a point I don't believe yourself to understand. I also don't think you understand how healers work and their mindset. I recommend actually leveling one, it might help you understand a bit better.

I'm having a hard time understanding this post. What is your question to us?

PS: We made our goal of 100 pages. I believe our work is done?

TLDR of thread:

• everyone is selfish
• healers who don't DPS think other people are arrogant and/or bad
• other people think healers who don't DPS are arrogant and/or bad
• healers that DPS make runs faster
• making runs faster makes some people sad
• some people don't like to DPS because other people suck at DPS

[KaitlanKela]

THIS IS STILL GOING ON? omfg

I'll do my best to summarize AGAIN.

1. Your job is to clear the instance
2. Using your whole toolkit will make this more efficient
3. Healers have DPS in their toolkit
Therefore: Healers DPSing makes clearing the instance more efficient.
Disclaimers
1. Your priority is to heal, so only DPS if your first job is covered. Definition: Covered - don't let the tank die.
2. Some people choose not to DPS when they could. They are bads. They have the right to choose to be bads.
3. When dealing with the bads, they're not going to PREVENT you from clearing 99% of the time, so roll eyes and move along.

[Iagainsti]

It's not making it harder for everyone else. If its already hard for a dps to meet requirements for a raid then its their fault, not the healers. Healer dps in raids is a luxury, not a requirement.

That's a fail; sorry to say, but the root of the word "luxury" is middle English meaning "excess". I do not believe there is such a thing as excess damage when we're talking top tier raiding. This comes back to utilizing your full tool kit. While the Devs have stated healer damage was not calculated into Alex Savage or Thordan ex, that does not mean it's excessive to refresh dots and pop CS during opportunity windows such as cast bars, etc. Again this has been echoed over 100 pages now, but don't pigeon-hole Healer classes because that was not how the classes were designed.

[KaitlanKela]

While the Devs have stated healer damage was not calculated into Alex Savage or Thordan ex...

I want to comment on this because Yoshi clarified this statement in a recent interview.

1. They DO consider Healer DPS: just the minimum DPS that they do when they're healing: Think Assize, or the DPS increase that comes with Fey Wind, etc.
2. They first set a minimum iLvl required for clearing. It is NOT the minimum iLvl for entry. The raids are designed to NOT be clearable until some new gear somes out. However, they CAN be cleared at minimum if the Healer/Tank DPS. In conclusion:

Excess Healer DPS IS required to clear at the initial iLvl

[MilesSaintboroguh]

So 1000+ replies and sitll the same circle jerking? 'ight.

[Andrea]

So 1000+ replies and sitll the same circle jerking? 'ight.

Its the forums. If you expected anything else I don't know what to tell you.

[MilesSaintboroguh]

It's just as grindy as the grinds themselves.