PLD would benefit from the ability to battle raise

[SpookyGhost]

Nope. It' is part of the calculation of enmity for Flash, and it also affects incoming cures.

It is a part of the enmity calculation for Flash, however that has nothing to do with damage mitigation or incoming cures. The incoming cure thing is a misunderstanding of the tooltip since 2.0, it affects YOUR OWN cures, not cures on you.

Anyway, just wanted to clear that up. You guys have fun.

[Kosmos992k]

It is a part of the enmity calculation for Flash, however that has nothing to do with damage mitigation or incoming cures. The incoming cure thing is a misunderstanding of the tooltip since 2.0, it affects YOUR OWN cures, not cures on you.

Anyway, just wanted to clear that up. You guys have fun.

That's great, it's still two more things than just impacting damage as you previously claimed.

Either way, you have fun too. Determination would still make an excellent candidate for a secondary stat that could be used to affect how tanks play and their damage (among other things) is calculated.

[Februs]

I know that the theory craft suggests that there is some minor improvement to single target DPS, but I'm not convinced that in actual play, it plays out as predicted. Since you can force blocks pretty effectively, the former Shield Swipe had potential to both boost dps and conserve TP. Now it's of questionable DPS benefit, hurts TP conservation, and ties up two other abilities to force 'proc' the skill as it's cool down ends. I find myself agreeing with those who see the changes to shield swipe as quite detrimental to the skill and job.

It depends on the circumstance, but yes. For the most part, taking Shield Swipe off of the GCD was a nerf to Pld's. oGCD Shield Swipe is a Dps increase on single targets. There's no doubt, but the difference is tiny, it only applies to single target Dps, and it comes at a huge cost.

Tp consumption is higher now and Shield Swipe's potency is lower. Both of these things counterbalance the tiny increase seen in oGCD Shield Swipe's Dps increase, because when the Pld runs out of Tp they suffer a greater Dps loss then they gained. Maintaining Shield Swipes at the minimum during such down time is still not a Dps increase, because the potency was nerfed. If the Pld is in a fight in which they can maintain their Tp (such as Thordan, where there is a lot of downtime) then oGCD Shield Swipe is an increase, but in any fight in which they maintain 100% uptime on the boss it is a decrease.

Further, in Mob tanking it always a decrease in Dps and enmity. Over 15s, RoH combined potency is 1220 in which the first move does not grant enmity. GCD Shield Swipe (using bulwark) could replace RoH for a combined potency of 1260 in which every move granted enmity. Further, you could use a combo move in between each Shield Swipe proc to increase Dps and enmity even more. oGCD Shield Swipe cannot do this, and still results in massive Tp drains if the Pld somehow manages to hold enmity using only RoH. It results in reduced enmity and potency. Pld's also have to use Flash more now, which is a 100% reduction in dps over spamming shield swipe.

[Immut]

It wouldn't work in the same fashion why clemency is bad, main tanking means your cast times will be interrupted, tank swapping would also be cumbersome because of the cd on provoke and it can be a wrench in the spanners for most fights

A wrench IS a spanner.

[Jim_Berry]

It wouldn't work in the same fashion why clemency is bad, main tanking means your cast times will be interrupted, tank swapping would also be cumbersome because of the cd on provoke and it can be a wrench in the spanners for most fights

Only if we had access to Surecast.

[Tint]

yes, paladin should be able to use raise in battle. and you don't have to argue at all, because it has nothing to do with the paladin

it has something to do with the whm ^^/

if the paladin can use raise in battle the whm will get a new trait instead of the useless battle-raise trait wich does nothing else than preventing the paladin from raise in battle... so yeah, this will probably buff the whm more than the pld. yes please ^__^

[Fernosaur]

yes, paladin should be able to use raise in battle. and you don't have to argue at all, because it has nothing to do with the paladin

it has something to do with the whm ^^/

if the paladin can use raise in battle the whm will get a new trait instead of the useless battle-raise trait wich does nothing else than preventing the paladin from raise in battle... so yeah, this will probably buff the whm more than the pld. yes please ^__^

The new trait would reduce Raise's cast time to like 7 seconds instead of 8 like they did with Stoneskin or something like that tho :'D I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you.

On the topic of battle raising for PLD, I think it would be an okay utility thing, but I also think PLD needs other fixes to their party support, which is the way the dev team seemed to be heading with the 3.0 skills but sort of sucked at implementing.

[Carstien]

No, because PLD has effectively unlimited MP and doesn't really use it on anything, so it would completely negate the resource penalty that's supposed to happen when you raise.

I'm against it too, but honestly, he suggested a 30 minute cooldown. That...that wouldn't be overpowered. It wouldn't even make them the preferred Tank, just give an option.

[Callback]

Phoenix Down should be readily available and useable in battle by everyone. What kind of FF game doesn't allow the entire party to use a cheap stock of phoenix down? It makes a good emergency recovery anyway.

[Februs]

Phoenix Down should be readily available and useable in battle by everyone. What kind of FF game doesn't allow the entire party to use a cheap stock of phoenix down? It makes a good emergency recovery anyway.

I have to admit that I was a little disappointed back when I first started playing this game that the items have such a pitiful role. My old FF instincts had me stockpiling healing items ... only to find out that they weren't really useful at all (aside from using Ether's as part of a caster rotation to extend their Dmg potency).

This is a bit of a side note, but I really want Chemist to be the next healer role to enter the game, just to bring back some of that old school Final Fantasy feeling. Maybe they could mix their own tonics or something, I dunno. I just think it would be cool to have a job that actually got some use out of healing items, even if they weren't stock healing items like potions or phoenix downs.