Astrologian misconceptions

[Lunafreya]

I have been playing Astrologian since it was introduced and it is my favourite class in the entire game. I have a geared one as my main at i203 and I am a damn good AST if I do say so myself. I never understand why people like to shite on AST as a healer when compared to SCH and WHM. Astro is easily the most well balanced healer and the cards can easily turn the tide of battle in your favour, and synastry is ridiculously good. The only thing Astrologian is missing is dps, imo. They have very low dps and not many dots. I was in a as1 group the other night and I got complemented as the better healer, surprisingly. I didn't think people allowed Astrologians in raids, especially savage. Can someone tell me what exactly makes people hate on Astro? I'm a bit confused because I always get all the comms and carry with mine, :P . What could SE do to make AST less hated?

[FunkyBunch]

. What could SE do to make AST less hated?

Make the players better? The problem most people have with certain roles, is that the average player is just average. But with some roles, average isn't good enough.
An average Paladin can't do enough DPS. An average AST can't keep everyone alive when it counts etc. It's not that the roles deserve hate, it's that below average and average players ruin the perception of the role for everyone.
I have a PLD friend who consistently pulls high DPS and tanks well, higher than most warriors we're ever grouped with. People still think PLD's can't do damage.
Yet yesterday when his group cleared A4S, he was number two for DPS (just under 1k). Yet 75% of PLDs get below 700 on the same fight (fflogs).

Anyways, when a job is harder, more people are bad at it, making it a misconception that the job is bad.

[technole]

It's really the player base and people's experiences with not so good AST players leading to it. So you have bias out there, even shutting out the AST role in party finders. I about laugh at these for Thordan and savage clears. These people who want clears are struggling to get players, yet they have no experience with what a good one will do. While many of us ASTs are clearing this content with no problem on a regular basis. Their loss? You bet.

Even YoshiP said it himself in his recent 4gamer interview last week the difference between a subpar and an excellent one is night and day. I couldn't agree more. He had nodded to considering some of the quality of life changes people are requesting like our high aggro generation and re-drawing same cards after shuffle. Our job isn't perfect, but certainly it's more than capable in end-game raiding.

One can even argue that AST/SCH is a better combo in A1S because you have the luxury of going in with the pull with a full spread balance before the split adding more DPS to the raid and if you draw up more DPS buffs before the split you are making the fight easier to clear and maybe help save a jump if you got the DPS. Not to mention our cooldowns like disable, synastry, and light speed work extremely well for all of the healing mechanics.

Back to the subpar player comment, two days ago I was tanking an A4 normal on my Dark Knight and we had 2 ASTs, shockingly both went Diurnal. Both struggled so much for obvious reasons, that I practically blew every cooldown in my book to live. I just don't get it considering Noct AST is so good in A4 you can eat every ball with an instant shield and practically take almost no damage. It was so bad to watch. Must be that thought in their head that Noct is "bad".

[Risvertasashi]

The only thing Astrologian is missing is dps, imo. They have very low dps and not many dots.?

Not to put too fine a point on it, but... you claim to know AST very well but then say this?

AST's DoTs are absurdly powerful (and never miss). Malefic II is only 10 potency behind Stone III, made up for by those absurdly strong DoTs. Gravity is only 10 potency behind Holy, but casts faster. WHM wins out when using PoM and some burst (assize for DPS), but all of its DoTs can miss and they don't match AST's DoTs. All in all, each has some advantages but in relative strength they are pretty close.

But back to your original question: bads will be bad. Some ASTs don't use cards at all. Stop and think about that for a moment. WHM has some very bad players too (Medica II mages anyone?), but for ARR was pretty much the carrying healer and so shielded from the reputation. SCH's very technical nature, and that it starts as a DPS class, creates a barrier to entry that attacts a certain type and discourages many others.

AST didn't have the headstart WHM did and started out relatively weak on heals. If you see people hating on AST, just point them to that A3S soloheal video.

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

Gravity is only 10 potency behind Holy.

Wait, what?

[Ghishlain]

Back to the subpar player comment, two days ago I was tanking an A4 normal on my Dark Knight and we had 2 ASTs, shockingly both went Diurnal. Both struggled so much for obvious reasons, that I practically blew every cooldown in my book to live. I just don't get it considering Noct AST is so good in A4 you can eat every ball with an instant shield and practically take almost no damage. It was so bad to watch. Must be that thought in their head that Noct is "bad".

It's a shame Noct Sect being good for a fight is the exception and not the rule. While I like Noct Sect, I also understand Diurnal is much better efficiency-wise outside of a select few instances. A4 is one of those fights where I will default Noct unless I'm paired with a SCH.

I do agree with the comments about AST requiring a higher train of thought to play well versus WHM or SCH. AST requires fundamental knowledge of how every job in the game plays (and any new job introduced / existing job modified with an expansion) to make calculated decisions about how best to use cards. It's also probably the one job in the game where anyone can make an argument to include a parsing tool because you want to be giving your DPS enhancing cards to the party member with the best DPS, even if it seems counter intuitive to the actual use of the card and/or party composition (ie, giving Balance to BRD/MCH in a BRD/MCH + Melee DPS party because said BRD/MCH is parsing higher than everyone else when they normally shouldn't be if you assume equal gear + skill level). There's a lot of variable ASTs have to consider that WHM or SCH normally can mostly ignore.

[Risvertasashi]

Wait, what?

You've got spell speed in effect there. They share the same base time, but AST, given the same SPS, will have a 5% cast time advantage.

[Ghishlain]

You've got spell speed in effect there.

Lyrica is indicating that there's no potency difference between Holy or Gravity. They also cast at the same speed but Gravity is approximately 20% less MP when on the same level due to having no Stun component.

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

You've got spell speed in effect there. They share the same base time, but AST, given the same SPS, will have a 5% cast time advantage.

I wasn't referring to the (re-)cast time. You stated:

Gravity is only 10 potency behind Holy, but casts faster.

I never quoted on the casting speed bit, as it's reliant on the sect you're in and it wasn't wrong in the first place. But Gravity definitely has the same potency as Holy with the same base cast time

[Risvertasashi]

Lyrica is indicating that there's no potency difference between Holy or Gravity. They also cast at the same speed but Gravity is approximately 20% less MP when on the same level due to having no Stun component.

Oh damn. When did holy get reduced from 210 potency? Completely missed that nerf...