Tanks can't keep aggro.

[Malicewolf]

Bad players in a MMORPG? Bad players failing at the single easiest role in the game? Nobody could ever have possibly seen this coming.

Wait. Did you just call tanking the easier role in the game?
Imma just sit hear with some popcorn and wait for the show to start *munches popcorn*

[AI_wass]

You're damn right I did. Tanking is the easiest role in the game, bar none.

[bardaboo]

Yuuup. You ever tanked a speed run? All a warrior does is overpower and flash. 5 mobs, same thing as 10 or 15. Oh look my health is getting low, maybe I'll use a cooldown or something.

[Malicewolf]

Well, to each their own I guess. I view the BLM rotation to be painfully boring with speed runs as well, but I never bothered to level it all the way up either. But fire II, fire II, fire II, fire II, transpose, blizzard, etc wasn't my cup of tea. I'm sure at a higher level, there's a flare someone in there. We could even go the bashing healer route here and say, "oh so hard to click cure when hp gets a little low".

Every class has its own unique parameters and specific situations they excel at. A warrior who just spams overpower and flash during speed runs is wasting his potential output (not to mention tp). As a PLD, even during speed runs, I don't have to constantly spam flash to hold aggro against DPs with better gear. If you know any class well, then you know that every run is different. All it takes is a single mess up from a healer to cause your entire rotation to change for a bit, else it ends up a wipe. We could say a DPS only has to memorize a few rotations and is simple. I PREFER to be a DPS half the time BECAUSE I find it WAY simpler than being a tank. Even when I do an absolutely amazing job as a DPS though, it usually goes unnoticed.

as a side note, all things above was said to make a point. Not saying I think any class is less important. I believe each has a role that must be filled, but none are the "easiest".

[Jpec07]

Better Tanks than me have given me some sound advice. "If they want to keep taking the hate from you let them keep it."

As a career tank, I will say: that's bad advice. If a DPS is just being a fool and attacking the wrong target after you've marked, that's one thing, but if a healer pulls off you? You'd better make damn sure you get that enmity back, or else your ass is going to die. The worst thing you can do as a tank is piss off your healer - you are nothing without them.

Really, as a healer, the only thing you can do is make sure they're in their tank stance, and make sure not to pre-HoT them, and to attack the right target. Otherwise, enmity really isn't too much your responsibility, and hate loss is on the tank.

[FunkyBunch]

Well, to each their own I guess. I view the BLM rotation to be painfully boring with speed runs as well, but I never bothered to level it all the way up either. But fire II, fire II, fire II, fire II, transpose, blizzard, etc wasn't my cup of tea. I'm sure at a higher level, there's a flare someone in there.

That's not how it works... at all. The AoE Rotation is Fire III, Fire II, Fire II, Fire II, Flare, Convert, Swiftcast, Flare, Trasponse. But not much kills faster than that.
Pre 60, the BLM rotation is a little mind-numbing (F3->F1,F1,F1 over and over).
But once you hit 60 it's bloody hard with all the timings and juggling as your two most powerful spells have two buffs you need before they can be cast and they run out at different times and you have exactly enough time to do the whole rotation if you're perfect. (Dodge an extra AoE or be a half-second late on a cast and WIFF there goes 5k damage).
I routinely grab hate from tanks. Not on purpose, but because tanks don't generate enough hate. If I target one mob only, it takes forever to get a group of 5 down. If I do the AoE damage combo, bad tanks will lose hate, and then I'm the tank for two or three of the mobs.
Thankfully, I can burst one of them down, but it's still a DPS loss if the tank loses enmity on one mob.

[Malicewolf]

Snip

As I stated, I did not level BLM all the way up, so I fall in your mind-numbing pre-60 category and I know the rotation gets much more difficult later on. And in this case, I'm purely talkin about the speed run rotation in which I'm looking to burn a large mob down in a dungeon.

And exactly. Bad tanks will lose aggro to a GOOD BLM. But a good tank who knows how to do his role will hold. Because if a bad tank tries to speed run and pulls too big of a mob with a healer good enough to sustain him, he will eventually lose hate as his TP and Mana aren't unlimited. Unless the DPS are also exceptional, he will run out of resources prior to the mob being burned and then it's a sh*tshow. But for clarification, the point I was making was directly in response to bardaboo's post. To say a tank just spams the same thing over and over and over and use that as an excuse for that job being "easy" is silly. It'll get you by for a little bit and that's it, but it won't sustain you through the harder content.

And I really hope your example is an exception ._. Because a tank should be trying to re-establish hate over a mob he loses.

[m3eansean]

Better Tanks than me have given me some sound advice. "If they want to keep taking the hate from you let them keep it."

Poor advice. Healer is not trying to rip hate off. So much for being a team player :/

[File2ish]

Bad players in a MMORPG? Bad players failing at the single easiest role in the game? Nobody could ever have possibly seen this coming.

While tanking is usually the easier role compared to healing (I'd put DPS and Tanking on the same level in terms of difficulty), it is also one of the most difficult roles depending on gear discrepancy, confidence in ability, and numerous other variables. (This is, of course, assuming the tank isn't actually "bad", not that there aren't tanks that don't know what they're doing).

When you have a slightly-moderately undergeared tank in a low level roulette or even a level 60 roulette doing literally everything possible to keep hate and still losing it to the synced down DPS and/or the healer (usually pre 30 for mrd/war, pre 40 for gld/pld for tank stances). While the game does give you all the equips you need through quests, not everyone does all the side quests nor are any of the quest given pieces of gear high quality pre heavensward.

And in the case of level 60 content; i150-170 weapons on a tank will eventually be unable to keep up with say a DRG or MNK going all out with their shiny new anima weapon if said tank is managing multiple targets due to the BLM spamming AoEs on a group with their shiny new i210 weapon. I say this from experience on my i175ish DRK on my alt (Tanith Aurion), I never lost hate, but it was difficult maintaining it on groups even on smaller pulls. The Monk in that group was also usually hanging around 80% of the enmity on bosses (in the Arboretum) too.

[Reinha]

I haven't had much trouble with tanks and aggro to be honest, apart from the occasional low geared tanks. Lack of cooldowns is by far the most common issue I run into. It's not even always a new tank doing it, but also the well geared "pros" who think they're too cool to use a cooldown on pull. Whenever I get one of those tanks I smh and wish I at least had Holy or E4E for mitigation... Look, I see you using your damage buff the moment it comes off cooldown every time, so I know you know what "buff" means. How about you use all of them.