3.15 relics...

[Aikaal]

2.x relic wasn't customizable until the Alexandrite stage.
I'm sure the 3.x relic will be able to be customized later on.

As a DEV you don't give out all the goods at the start.

I really had to chuckle about the atma grind 2.0 though. So .... unimaginative.
Guess they are reeeallly desperate for FATE participants.

So taking away what you gave to your players is fine? This is insulting your community.

[Granyala]

So taking away what you gave to your players is fine?

Yes it is perfectly fine in cyclical MMOs and happens on a lot of other levels as well.
Hint: gear resets every expansion, nullifying your "hard work".

Also. if the relic were customizable AND had the same item level as the best raid weapons it would automatically be BiS and thus MANDATORY for every half serious raider.
Doesn't take a rocket scientist to see why Devs might be reluctant to give the player that kind of freedom in the initial stages.

[Aikaal]

Yes it is perfectly fine in cyclical MMOs and happens on a lot of other levels as well.
Hint: gear resets every expansion, nullifying your "hard work".

Also. if the relic were customizable AND had the same item level as the best raid weapons it would automatically be BiS and thus MANDATORY for every half serious raider.
Doesn't take a rocket scientist to see why Devs might be reluctant to give the player that kind of freedom in the initial stages.

I'll give you a hint then. For BLM and PLD at least that have 210 weapons. The Relic is 100% useless if you go for the stats only. Quite unfair. You also forgot my argument SE said Relic is an item that is suppose to follow you during all of your adventure. It's not following me at all lol. They made the decision to allow customization in 2.x on relic. Changing back and forth your stats wasn't free also, it was extra grinding.

Unfortunately for you, it was the case in 2.4. You could go with a 115 Nexus with the stats of your choice. You don't strip a feature that was given to you.

Relic in 3.x is also not the same in 2.x. You fail again to understand my point. Relic was available at launch in 2.x. The Relic grind to iLevel 90 was actually fun. Raid weapons ended up being slightly better than Relic. You couldn't custom it at the beginning, the feature was not there. When they introduced Atmas and the scroll system you could custom.

What happened in 3.0? Relic wasn't available. We can stop comparing there. Some players already have iLevel 210 weapons. in 2.0 nobody had an iLevel 90 weapon. As a matter of fact, the only iLevel 90 weapon was the relic. Players didn't had a choice. Now we do have a choice. We have 3 different iLevel 210 available. There is no reason not to keep the feature. They had the possibility at 3.0 to have the relic grind start and we'd have an iLevel 200 Relic with no customization. Then have the iLevel 210 Relic with the stats you want but they didn't! You can't giving the same excuse that you didn't have enough time to implement it. This is a stupid logic.

[Granyala]

You fail again to understand my point.

To be perfectly honest: your "point" comes across as "waah waah I didn't get what I expected!11" kind of whining.

Would it be nice to be able to pick the stats? Sure.
Is it a necessity? No.

If you have a better weapon from a raid, and like how the relic looks -> glamour and be done with it. At least until they make the stats variable again in the later stages.

As for the companion weapon: If I remember correctly, SE didn't plan on doing another relic, that's why HW shipped w/o such a quest chain. They are only inputting it now because of community demand (or the need to repopulate dead areas of content like FATES and leveling dungeons).

[Aikaal]

To be perfectly honest: your "point" comes across as "waah waah I didn't get what I expected!11" kind of whining.

Would it be nice to be able to pick the stats? Sure.
Is it a necessity? No.

If you have a better weapon from a raid, and like how the relic looks -> glamour and be done with it. At least until they make the stats variable again in the later stages.

As for the companion weapon: If I remember correctly, SE didn't plan on doing another relic, that's why HW shipped w/o such a quest chain. They are only inputting it now because of community demand (or the need to repopulate dead areas of content like FATES and leveling dungeons).

And you don't even see my point nor argue against what I'm saying. I'm not sure if I'm arguing with someone or a tool. People are comparing the first stage relic of 3.x like the first stage of 2.x (which is a lie and I gave my points already)

- I invested the current grind. Atma farm, dungeon grinding, law/hunts/dungeon grind (alexander normal woooo)/beast-tribe(okay, this is new. yeahhhhh no thx), hq crafted items. 100% was there in 2.x. Lack of originality. This is recycled content and recycled code. It doesn't take much time to change names on a code you already have and works. The only thing they've work is the finished stage of the relic sprite. Really cheap and fast to make.
- This could have been there at the launch. If they wanted the relic to be exactly the same than 2.x. It was easy to release the first 2 steps and put the weapon at iLevel 190-200.
- They removed a key feature from relic : custom stats. This price is high if we consider we waited 5-6 months.

Those are the main point I'm against this Relic. If you think I'm simply a whiner, then you don't read or you're a tool and you aren't worth arguing with. I,d like to hear what is good about the 3.15 Relic grind? As far as I'm concerned, the only valid arguments are:
- Catch up for none-raider (Even the crap BLM relic is better than 205 Thordan's Staff)
- This is a really good time sink for the lack of content.

I don't see better reasons. Customization was the main attraction and reason for many players and it's not there right now.

[Velhart]

snip

The timing for relics are definitely awkward at best. They would of definitely been something to work on during 3.0, the time where it took even longer for 3.1 to come out than a normal patch. It would have to have been adjusted around other weapons coming out like esoteric weapons and primal ones, but yes relic quest should of been right at Heavenward's release or at worst 3.05. Ideally we should be on the next step right now if things actually done right. Many people are meh right now just because we are at a point that many have ilvl200+ gear. The timing was just off.

Not to mention, they built it up so much just for it (shouldn't be surprised at all) just a series of recycled content. This is what took so long to make?

[cgbspender]

This is what took so long to make?

No no. What took them long was to create and implement ONE new (useless) culinarian recipe. And another alchemist (just as useless) one. You know, we, culinarans have extremey high standards regarding the meals we provide. It takes time to create one recipe, you know.

Mea Culpa

[Granyala]

- I invested the current grind. Atma farm, dungeon grinding, law/hunts/dungeon grind (alexander normal woooo)/beast-tribe(okay, this is new. yeahhhhh no thx), hq crafted items. 100% was there in 2.x. Lack of originality. This is recycled content and recycled code. It doesn't take much time to change names on a code you already have and works. The only thing they've work is the finished stage of the relic sprite. Really cheap and fast to make.

No need to argue about that as I completely agree. What "content" (thank God I had a Zeta) I have seen so far is completely underwhelming and absolutely unimaginative. (to put it politely)

The reason for the delay is simple: they had to design the models. Artists need time as they have other workloads to deal with.
Also I'm reasonably sure that they deliberately use the relic grind to repopulate abandoned content, hence why they withheld the release.

- They removed a key feature from relic : custom stats.

This is where we disagree. Yes you had custom stats but it was hardly a key feature, as only the absolute hardcore players maxed the stats and spent MILLIONS on det materia for a gain so miniscule that you'd never feel it in any practical scenario. I'd even go as far and challenge you to provide measurements between a max relic and a slightly suboptimal one.

Yes, yes you may go on and insult me now.

I,d like to hear what is good about the 3.15 Relic grind?

In addition to the two points you list:
-unique visual (if it happens to be your taste)

As for the PROCESS of getting the relic: 2.x relic was nothing but a mindless, repetitive grind. I don't expect the 3.x relic to be any different.
Fun and innovative game design? Definitely not.
If I hadn't had my Zeta, I'd probably not bother with it at all, because the repetition of the Atma grind would pretty effectively scare me away.

I understand your frustration. From a game content point of view I too expected something more than "grind fates for RNG drop" and "push through underleveled dungeons".