Absolute frustration at not being able to see my own DPS (ps4)

[Boss_Koivula]

You are forgetting that DCUO was free for PSN+ owners. Every kid with an PSN account in the world had an access to the game for free. Not having to pay for anything makes the enviroment more hostile, since if you do get banned from the game, the only investment lost was your own character. You cant compare f2p game to b2p game with a monthly sub.

[ChocoFeru]

Implement a parser ONLY on dummies, so people can test their rotations.
Also make a Dummy with same evasion caps as Raid bosses.

I wouldn't implement it in real-time everywhere, because it will give more troubles. People will kick the lower DPS always, even if he was dead because the healer or tank did a bad job.


You should know that queuing on Dutyfinder will bring you unexperienced players. I know it, and that's why when I queue with randoms I just have patience and understand that there may be casuals and I have no right to curse them. The best thing I can do is tell them how to do a rotation or how to do a boss.

[Toguro]

You are forgetting that DCUO was free for PSN+ owners. Every kid with an PSN account in the world had an access to the game for free. Not having to pay for anything makes the enviroment more hostile, since if you do get banned from the game, the only investment lost was your own character. You cant compare f2p game to b2p game with a monthly sub.

What kind of kid? 16-year old?. I'm talking about the older subbed legendary players that were mostly like this

[Critical-Limit]

Let

First let me say I'm sorry for your depression I have a close friend who suffers from it as well.

I understand the chemicals in your brain can make you randomly sad. Not by choice, my friend said sometimes he feels sad even when nothing bad is even happening.

So I understand. But obviously that's a special case as even if you adopt the right mindset you'll still occasionally feel sad for no reason or nervous in high stakes.

Im not doubting you Im not a doctor, but do you criticize yourself that harshly over a simple math mistake? Or if you trip, or even mistakes you find funny? Probably not, you feel extra in this game because you have a goal. You want to be good, you dont want to let people relying on you down.

These things increase the likely hood of entering a self loathing state.

Thank you for sharing and not using it to debunk that being embarrassed is a person own fault or not fault if you suffer depression.

[Raffounz]

Run with a PC player with parser and upload this to famous site for dps rankings; analayze your results with others and study world best rotations in real fights

[KaitlanKela]

I've been thinking about this.


A parser where only you can see your numbers. Make asking for other people's numbers a punishable offense under harassment.

However, the parser is connected to a lodestone "app" similar to what's going right now for PVP rankings. However, the app only displays the "average" and "high" numbers for each class for each boss encounter. Say I'm a DRG playing T5, and my personal parser gives me 500, but then I go online and I see that the average is 900 and the high is 1250 for a DRG on this fight (just throwing example numbers out). Time to go to the internet for some help. But if my number's 1000, I'm doing better than average and I probably am contributing to the group in a positive way.

Also, for the critique of my cases analysis about the silent kicks. Already happening. Hell, I think it might happen less WITH a parser because right now it's easy to falsely accuse people by mistake when they may or may not be the problem. And if someone kicks you for putting out numbers that are not 100% ++ perfect, you're probably better off anyway. Players like that are toxic even if they let you stay. However, under my proposed idea above, this wouldn't be a problem either. The player preforming at 1000 knows that he's contributing, and it's better than average. It's not the BEST but it's close enough to where any @ssholes prolly couldn't tell or at least the couldn't tell WHO it was. And if they're using a third-party parser on a PC and they get the 1000 number, at least now there's a benchmark. They're more likely to say, that's better than average and pretty close to the max, instead of potentially kicking you for having really impossible exceptions, like 'why aren't they doing 1500'!?!?!

[Kaurie]

this part is not something happening and that SE wants to deal with, this part is the problem and is happening more then not.

There we have it, inexplicable proof that people are kicked from dungeons more often than they are completed.

[UBERHAXED]

I read dPS forum stuff all the time. It's usually "theory" on potency like you said but then people run it through the parse to "test it" its one of the things they did to find out if clipping certain dots was worth it.

Plenty of times people were wrong on theory proven through parse. Fracture being a par of monk rotation back in the day people believed in theory fracture was DPS loss. Turns out no there is a small window of time where it's dPS gain.

Spreading misinformation to this degree should be a crime against the human race and you should go to jail. You literally just said that try and error and measuring can possibly be better than theory. There's no such thing as "theory proven wrong by parse". That means there is either a bug in the parser (likely) or the person doing the theory had some fundamental flaw (which does not fault anyone else doing theory). Please in detail with proof give an instance where a perfect rotation (which are all published by dates here) was not a perfect rotation (contradiction?) This a tautology; the rotation cannot be improved by definition. Also theory is based on relative value (that is potency). Unless the potencies displayed in the game are incorrect, then there is no better value to compare other than a potency per second rotation. There have been cases where there was actually a bug in the game regarding moves (in 2.0 for example, flaming arrow always crit, effectively giving it 350*1.5 potency instead of 350*(1.5* crit chance) but this translates ultimately to a bug in the parser, since it bases values like DoTs from the information written the game. So even in this case, the parser will just give you in accurate numbers. I'll give you a metaphor:

You just told me that I should build a prototype space ship and keep reinventing the wheel, making random "design" decision instead of spending the overhead designing it properly using physics. If you some how think this a valid argument, then I'd advise you to keep it to yourself so you don't confirm to everyone your degree of stupidity.

No, what's ironic is that you don't realize the two are actually the same thing.

You cannot have one without the other, how can one improve if they don't know where improvement starts?

Self improvement and party evaluation are not mutually exclusive concepts, they go hand in hand.

Finding the weakest link in the party also means that player now has a point of reference to start improving, any player can sit there and spike high numbers on a stationary dummy parse because it doesn't move or hit back, the real test is going into live content where it matters and seeing if your skills and gear hold up while you deal with fight mechanics.

Maybe that player learns they need to hold a GCD between a certain move? Maybe that DRG knows they are going to lose BoTD due to a phase change so they need to adjust before hand? Maybe the BLM has to change the timing of when they toss down Ley Lines in order to get the most out of it's duration? Maybe your accuracy was too low for the encounter or maybe you're overshooting by 100 points and can swap out a piece of gear?

These are things you learn in live content and are exactly how you improve your play.

The thing is this happens at the same time you are also trying to clear content and this is where proper evaluation and data helps and if a single player isn't up to the level of the content it doesn't mean that the 7 others in the party aren't either, they should have every right to know this and adjust accordingly if they need to in order to continue making attempts on the fight.

The key is not taking critique as a negative.

It's entirely possible to be the weakest link one run, get some practice in and turn around to top the charts the next time around, but if you had no idea that you were under-performing before then how would you have any idea whether or not you needed to improve?

Please, step by step, tell me how a parser giving me a 1245 will tell me to use BoTD before a phase change. In detail.

I think I still missed the part where the parser actually improves your dps. It's a measurement tool which only tell you how much damage you did at the end/time. Knowing this arbitrary scalar value will not tell you to put raging strikes before the iron jaws reapplication, common sense does (which incidentally does not require a parser). It's only literal use is to determine if a piece of gear you swapped was beneficial. Parsers cannot improve your rotation, just as your boss telling you that you are productive only 46% of the time cannot improve your productivity. Every single person (disclaimer: assuming people use a brain) knows when they perform poorly for a fight. Every time you deviate from the perfect dummy rotation, you have a dps loss. A parser does not tell you what the perfect rotation is, nor does it give you messages about what you did that was not part of the perfect rotation. Using a parser will not improve your rotation. You should have known your perfect rotation from the start! Please do not argue in favor of using a parser if you do not understand it's usage and what the number means.

I'm pro-parser btw; I know exactly how to use the values that are issued.

[melisande]

Spreading misinformation to this degree should be a crime against the human race and you should go to jail. You literally just said that try and error and measuring can possibly be better than theory. There's no such thing as "theory proven wrong by parse". That means there is either a bug in the parser (likely) or the person doing the theory had some fundamental flaw (which does not fault anyone else doing theory). Please in detail with proof give an instance where a perfect rotation (which are all published by dates here) was not a perfect rotation (contradiction?) This a tautology; the rotation cannot be improved by definition. Also theory is based on relative value (that is potency). Unless the potencies displayed in the game are incorrect, then there is no better value to compare other than a potency per second rotation. There have been cases where there was actually a bug in the game regarding moves (in 2.0 for example, flaming arrow always crit, effectively giving it 350*1.5 potency instead of 350*(1.5* crit chance) but this translates ultimately to a bug in the parser, since it bases values like DoTs from the information written the game. So even in this case, the parser will just give you in accurate numbers. I'll give you a metaphor:

You just told me that I should build a prototype space ship and keep reinventing the wheel, making random "design" decision instead of spending the overhead designing it properly using physics. If you some how think this a valid argument, then I'd advise you to keep it to yourself so you don't confirm to everyone your degree of stupidity.




Please, step by step, tell me how a parser giving me a 1245 will tell me to use BoTD before a phase change. In detail.

I think I still missed the part where the parser actually improves your dps. It's a measurement tool which only tell you how much damage you did at the end/time. Knowing this arbitrary scalar value will not tell you to put raging strikes before the iron jaws reapplication, common sense does (which incidentally does not require a parser). It's only literal use is to determine if a piece of gear you swapped was beneficial. Parsers cannot improve your rotation, just as your boss telling you that you are productive only 46% of the time cannot improve your productivity. Every single person (disclaimer: assuming people use a brain) knows when they perform poorly for a fight. Every time you deviate from the perfect dummy rotation, you have a dps loss. A parser does not tell you what the perfect rotation is, nor does it give you messages about what you did that was not part of the perfect rotation. Using a parser will not improve your rotation. You should have known your perfect rotation from the start! Please do not argue in favor of using a parser if you do not understand it's usage and what the number means.

I'm pro-parser btw; I know exactly how to use the values that are issued.

Nailed it! Exacctly!!!! Thank you seriously.

[Kaurie]

Spreading misinformation to this degree should be a crime against the human race and you should go to jail. You literally just said that try and error and measuring can possibly be better than theory.

Go to jail? Seriously? Let's remain civil and mature in this discussion. Trial and error is a major part of proving theories

There's no such thing as "theory proven wrong by parse".

Yes there is

the person doing the theory had some fundamental flaw

That is what proving a theory wrong is. It is finding a flaw in the theory. Theories are proven wrong via running several consistent experiments and monitoring the data. That is what a parser helps with.

Please in detail with proof give an instance where a [dummy] perfect rotation (which are all published by dates here) was not a perfect rotation [in every situation] (contradiction?)

This barely makes any sense as a question, but essentially a perfect rotation may not transfer well in to every fight (due to mechanics, jumps, adds etc). In order to illustrate my answer, I added square brackets into your quote.

Also theory is based on relative value (that is potency). Unless the potencies displayed in the game are incorrect, then there is no better value to compare other than a potency per second rotation. There have been cases where there was actually a bug in the game regarding moves (in 2.0 for example, flaming arrow always crit, effectively giving it 350*1.5 potency instead of 350*(1.5* crit chance) but this translates ultimately to a bug in the parser, since it bases values like DoTs from the information written the game. So even in this case, the parser will just give you in accurate numbers.

Correct, that is how one comes up with their theory, by testing math. That said, due to the complexities of all the various skills, buffs that can be applied via your team and yourself, potions as well as debuffs and mechanics from given fights, it's great to test your said theory with a tool that will tell you if you're doing what you expect.

Please, step by step, tell me how a parser giving me a 1245 will tell me to use BoTD before a phase change. In detail.

Well, you go in to the dungeon and use BoTD at one point several times and see your numbers. Then you go in and try using it at another point and see how your numbers change. This will help you understand when is best to use it.

For example, maybe I want to use Raging Strikes after I dot up, use paintflare/fester/fester/dreadwyrm, so I can have both raging, deathflare and x-drac pot up for another fester + ruin II + tridisaster and deathflare. However, in X fight, when I do that, I end up having 6 seconds of raging strikes ticking away while Y boss is jumping. Common sense would tell me that is a waste, but the parser can help me see exactly by how much of a waste. Perhaps it wasn't a waste at all if I deathflare before the jump, as all I lose is a few ticks on the dot. Perhaps, I need to hold all of those skills til after the jump and should just use Ruin I. Alright, so there are various situations, and I can probably do the math for every single encounter I run in to, but do we play this game to sit around with a calculator? Probably not, what is great is having a tool that shows us how are actions are changing with various attempts and ideas.

I think I still missed the part where the parser actually improves your dps.

This depends how you want to read in to what people are saying. No one has claimed that a parser actually increases DPS on it's own. Everyone is saying it's a tool that lets you see if you are performing poorly, and will give you feedback with how changes in your playstyle affect this.

Parsers cannot improve your rotation

False, they can help you determine how your rotation is working and provide you the information which helps with adjusting. I am not saying a parser will improve your rotation on its own, but it will help towards that goal. Further, you can use the tool to see how you compare to other people of your same job and gear level, and ask for pointers when necessary.

just as your boss telling you that you are productive only 46% of the time cannot improve your productivity.

Having a parser that gave you DPS once wouldn't help you improve your performance either. Parsers give real time data on how well you are doing.

Every single person (disclaimer: assuming people use a brain) knows when they perform poorly for a fight.

That is not true and is offensive to anyone who doesn't. I have played with plenty of people who perform very poorly, but have no idea that they did. These people were not stupid, they just didn't think about everything the same way you or I did.

Every time you deviate from the perfect dummy rotation, you have a dps loss.

I mostly agree with this statement, even though it is factually incorrect. AoE can increase your DPS well above a dummy parse. The question is, is that AoE actually helpful or not?