A former WAR's Paradigm Shift

[Kuwagami]

Then they were given the wrong role...
And months ago, people talked trash about DRK players thinking they'd just act like would-be DPS to cope out the fact that it's a tank...

months ago, people were still seeing tank and healer dps as a bonus that you could do without, rather than a requirement. Then Heavensward came.

[Reynhart]

Then Heavensward came.

And nothing split the playerbase more than that.

[Rhaja]

Then they were given the wrong role...
And months ago, people talked trash about DRK players thinking they'd just act like would-be DPS to cope out the fact that it's a tank...

As much as I loved playing my WAR in 2.X, I was also fairly vocal to friends and FC that it wasn't a tank. Yeah I could go out there and tank, but the class plays like a DPS before 3.0; I've been holding off but I'm pretty certain I'll feel even more like a DPS once I get my levels up more. But honestly, get rid of the damage drop and enmity gain of defiance, drop its armor to DRGs, and that class turns straight dps.

DRG could have been the more complex burst melee, WAR the more straight forward burst melee.

But hey, was a more fun alternative to PLD XD

[Twilite]

Moral of the story: Stay away from the tank sub-forums.

Pretty much.

[Februs]

Which is why I'm glad that strength tanks will be abolished and content is going back to being mechanic-heavy in 3.2.

The problem isn't the use of Str accessories. That has been a common thing since the Coil days. As soon as your primary gear outclasses the Trial/Raid, people swapped to Str gear. The problem is the general attitude and mentality of the new breed of tanks that have made an appearance in HW, thinking that they can substitute for a Dps. SE is, partly, responsible for perpetuating this attitude, because they designed a bunch of Trial/Raids that require almost no technical mechanics an have difficulty that only scales directly with DPS output. This kind of thing enables the silly minded people who think they can completely forego doing their actual job in favour of SICK DEEPS!

If SE is really planning on going back to mechanic heavy fights in 3.2 than it might solve some of the problem (replacing it with a new generation of Dps-Tanks that have no idea how to avoid simple mechs) but it won't change the viability of using Str accessories. Even Pld's get a better use for Str/Det than they do out of Vit, especially when they start over- gearing.

[Brian_]

People talk about mechanic heavy fights as if the fights we currently have aren't mechanic heavy or are less mechanic heavy than 2.X fights. A3S and A4S, the two fights that presumably popularized the necessity of tank DPS, are more mechanically complicated than pretty much anything we've seen aside from maybe T9.

What has changed is that tanks are expected to do more. The role has become more demanding and the job has become more complex. Now, not only are they expected to survive damage and deal with mechanics, they are also expected to maximize the potential of their job by doing those things AND maximizing their DPS. In forcing people to really push their DPS, they force you to really min-max your play. It's tough for some to stomach, but tanking went from pretty brain-dead pre-HW to being much more difficult now. Before, you didn't need to stance dance to maximize DPS. You didn't need to maximize CD usage. A lot of very mediocre tanks were carried through content. Ask a lot of the tanks that clear A3S. They can probably tell you every single GCD they use from start to finish. That type of precision and polish was not required before.

[Leonus]

What has changed is that tanks are expected to do more. The role has become more demanding and the job has become more complex. Now, not only are they expected to survive damage and deal with mechanics, they are also expected to maximize the potential of their job by doing those things AND maximizing their DPS. In forcing people to really push their DPS, they force you to really min-max your play. It's tough for some to stomach, but tanking went from pretty brain-dead pre-HW to being much more difficult now. Before, you didn't need to stance dance to maximize DPS. You didn't need to maximize CD usage. A lot of very mediocre tanks were carried through content. Ask a lot of the tanks that clear A3S. They can probably tell you every single GCD they use from start to finish. That type of precision and polish was not required before.

I think this has a lot more truth to it than most will want to accept. This is what's getting me back into tanking. To get more people to into the role, I feel like it should be more than just surviving and holding the bosses attention. When yo feel you are doing the two former AND making a meaningful contribution to the overall completion of the trial by actively killing the boss, it becomes much more enjoyable. At least for me.

[Reynhart]

What has changed is that tanks are expected to do more. The role has become more demanding and the job has become more complex. Now, not only are they expected to survive damage and deal with mechanics, they are also expected to maximize the potential of their job by doing those things AND maximizing their DPS.

Yes, this is true, but if you really want to be technical, they make "tanks" more demanding, not "tanking".

For me, it would have been more interesting to expand on tanking. Creating more ways to mitigate, a little bit of random where you have to react accordingly, etc....

[Kuwagami]

Making tanks become beefy dps doesn't appeal to tanks. It appeals to wannabe dps.

Thing is though, SE solved the lack of tanks. Now you have WARs and DRKs everywhere. Even I can at least acknowledge that.


Once again, come at me. Challenge me on my tanking ability, and I'll be happy.

[Reynhart]

Making tanks become beefy dps doesn't appeal to tanks. It appeals to wannabe dps.

It appeals to one kind of tank.
They're not less legit.

But having multiple tank jobs should provide enough ways to appeal to everyone. All jobs shouldn't be forced to follow the exact same meta.