SE Just Remove Specialist Recipes Please

[OoglieBooglie]

You know, if they wanted to FORCE you to truly specialize, they could make it 3 specialties per account. If you wanted to be super duper omnicrafter, you'd have to have 3 subs then.

I really don't think it's THAT bad. Whoop dee friggin doo, not everyone can make everything. The limiting factor is likely to be just doing it instead of favor mats with this stuff anyway, so I doubt it'll stay at 1 million gil or whatever per bsm ingot.

[EvinnaReed]

I could live with it if they just got rid of the mats as specialist recipes. That alone would help a lot.

[Caimie_Tsukino]

I could live with it if they just got rid of the mats as specialist recipes. That alone would help a lot.

Same for me! This arrangement is annoying as hell, it doesn't help with resolving market manipulation at all, and it backfires onto single class crafters.

The fact that they haven't been able to come up with a difficult recipe that can utilize the Whistle system yet just means the dev team is failing.

Unfortunately, these specialist recipes are OUT now. It's very unlikely that they will be removed.

Imo, they need to:
(1) buff up the Specialists Actions,
(2) change the low rate of "goods" of starred recipes back to normal rate (because the whole Whistle system depends on "goods"!), then
(3) create some very difficult recipes... so difficult that even level 50 cross class skills are unable to do it. Then the buffed up Specialist Actions will naturally be utilized.

Only then will Specialization become meaningful.

[MN_14]

On the plus side, even the i185 gear sets are more or less glamour pieces that can also serve as battle gear. They are white pieces only, so they're probably not considered to be at the same level as green pieces. However, it does raise the question over how they intend to handle future green/blue recipes.

Imo, they need to:
(1) buff up the Specialists Actions,
(2) change the low rate of "goods" of starred recipes back to normal rate (because the whole Whistle system depends on "goods"!), then
(3) create some very difficult recipes... so difficult that even level 50 cross class skills are unable to do it. Then the buffed up Specialist Actions will naturally be utilized.

Only then will Specialization become meaningful.

If they were to increase the rate of good procs back to pre-HW, they'll have to find a way of separating the specialization system from the standard cross class system. Right now, the proc rate has been balanced for the cross class approach, with the Heart skill "correcting" it to work with specialization skills. Drastically changing the proc rate would upset the balance designed for cross class crafters.

[Katlyna]

I cordially disagree. Call me selfish, but due to my wife and I working closely together and both being omnicrafters, I am OK with the current Specialist system and recipes. The Specialist system does seem to need more development, and hopefully we'll see that in 3.23.15 in December or 3.2 next year.

I do understand that others will have legit reasons to disagree.

See that's almost like saying I have two accounts though. Because between you two you have 6. So the current changes have relatively little impact on you. All the current system does is annoy anyone who doesn't like or want to partner with someone else to make extra items.

IF IF IF, they had made a distinct number of interesting items available to all specialist skills, and the selection had good meaning then they would start to have something to really segregate and force crafters to focus... with this said I'm not jump up and down a fan of such a system simple because they started in the world of omnicrafting and I prefer it that way. Its hard to give up a huge chunk of crafting unless I gain some meaningfully bonus out of doing so. Right now there just appears to be no bonus. It just feels kind of sucky.

[Mindy_Macready]

The specialist should come with an innate increase in Goods over non-specialists, instead of a lousy version that requires blue scrip farming of items, that doesn't guarantee any procs and would only provide 4 at max for 45 cp.

[Caimie_Tsukino]

If they were to increase the rate of good procs back to pre-HW, they'll have to find a way of separating the specialization system from the standard cross class system. Right now, the proc rate has been balanced for the cross class approach, with the Heart skill "correcting" it to work with specialization skills. Drastically changing the proc rate would upset the balance designed for cross class crafters.

Yes, the proc rate right now is reduced so that the cross class approach won't go overpowered. So naturally, if the proc rate is increased back to pre-HW, suddenly everything will be way too easy using cross class. But at this point even 2 stars are not that difficult anyway for us, especially when we gradually acquire more and more i170/i180. It's not a game-breaker to have older recipes becoming easier and easier (in fact, that's how things should be, and has always been).

So my idea is to create new recipes that are just super super hard, so that even with the normal good proc rate + cross class cannot handle, and make it so that people have to rely on Specialist Actions + cross class to deal with it. This will add some meaning/value to the Whistle System, thus making "Specialization" useful. Yet, for this to work, the Goods must proc frequently for the Whistle stack to fall, and the majority of the Specials Action need to be buffed, so that they outmatch cross class's powers in dealing these super hard recipes.

[Caimie_Tsukino]

The specialist should come with an innate increase in Goods over non-specialists, instead of a lousy version that requires blue scrip farming of items, that doesn't guarantee any procs and would only provide 4 at max for 45 cp.

Great idea! That works too! Just make the SOUL CRYSTAL having an additional effect of "increasing Goods proc rate for starred items"! Hey, this is perfect!!!! Heart of the [craft] should be buffed to 100% proc rate for 3 steps instead! Make the Specialist System "overpowering", then make the recipes even more overpowering! Make everything completely outmatch cross class! Then the whole thing won't be obsolete!

[MN_14]

Great idea! That works too! Just make the SOUL CRYSTAL having an additional effect of "increasing Goods proc rate for starred items"! Hey, this is perfect!!!! Heart of the [craft] should be buffed to 100% proc rate for 3 steps instead! Make the Specialist System "overpowering", then make the recipes even more overpowering! Make everything completely outmatch cross class! Then the whole thing won't be obsolete!

Unfortunately, I think that if they made things that unbalanced, the recipes would have to be super hard, making the traditional cross class method worthless. As well, since cross class skills can be combined with specialist skills, it'll probably be a balancing nightmare. Single class crafters might even complain about the "omni-crafters" that are ruining specialization due to their ability advantage.

[Caimie_Tsukino]

Unfortunately, I think that if they made things that unbalanced, the recipes would have to be super hard, making the traditional cross class method worthless. As well, since cross class skills can be combined with specialist skills, it'll probably be a balancing nightmare. Single class crafters might even complain about the "omni-crafters" that are ruining specialization due to their ability advantage.

Make it super complex then! Have recipes that can use ONLY basic crafting skills and Specialist Actions, while also have recipes that can use a combination of cross class + specialist actions!

Single class crafters are not doing much better at the moment anyway. At least if Specialist Actions > Cross Class, then single class crafters will have a chance even though Omni-crafters will always have an edge.

Recipes that cannot use cross class will make it EQUAL for omni-crafters and single class crafters. Where as recipes that can use both cross class and specialist actions will of course favor omni-crafters more, but if recipes difficulty and Specialist Actions' powers are insanely buffed, the that edge will not be too big.

Still, it can be balanced so that it does not render cross class obsolete. It's hard to imagine things like Byregot being any weaker than any Specialist Action. So that edge will always be there for omni-crafters, and it's OK! It's only fair for people who put more effort into it to have a bit more edge.