Are MNKs still desired?

[Kaisersoke]

monk dps is still about 30 dps or so higher than ninja counting trick attack.

ofc the numbers fluxuate but a monk is def doing more damage than ninjas easily right now. ninja is better for burst phases, monk is way higher overall.

[Spagnutty]

MNK and NIN are very well balanced right now. DRG is a little OP but not excessively.

MNK has just-barely the highest single target DPS, but doesn't bring anything else to the table. That's FINE, and does a lot to differentiate the different melee jobs.
When all the NIN group buffs settle out, NIN usually offers more total raid damage. It can be hard for ninjas to look past their own personal numbers. NIN is in great shape and their most legitimate complaint (Mudra-lag) will probably be addressed next patch.

Most raid groups start with a DRG, and then add either a MNK or a NIN. The two jobs are close enough that either can be added to a group depending on availability, friends, favorites etc.

[Kaisersoke]

MNK and NIN are very well balanced right now. DRG is a little OP but not excessively.

MNK has just-barely the highest single target DPS, but doesn't bring anything else to the table. That's FINE, and does a lot to differentiate the different melee jobs.
When all the NIN group buffs settle out, NIN usually offers more total raid damage. It can be hard for ninjas to look past their own personal numbers. NIN is in great shape and their most legitimate complaint (Mudra-lag) will probably be addressed next patch.

Most raid groups start with a DRG, and then add either a MNK or a NIN. The two jobs are close enough that either can be added to a group depending on availability, friends, favorites etc.

monks are doing on average about 150 more dps than other melee, last i checked, 150 dps is a lot and by no means "just barely" they also bring traited mantra which does wonders in heavy raid damage encounters like as3.

[MrCookTM]

monks are doing on average about 150 more dps than other melee, last i checked, 150 dps is a lot and by no means "just barely" they also bring traited mantra which does wonders in heavy raid damage encounters like as3.

Let's see. Dragoon was highest personal single target dps before monk got the 2.36% buff. The math is easy enough, I'm not going to elaborate any further. Yes, they're now "just barely" higher than dragoon. The difference between nin and mnk in personal st dps is around the 150 range at current item levels, that's correct.

Traited mantra is nice to have especially for progression, but by no means a tool that notably increases raid dps. Even if it's like two medica's less for the whm to cast, that's only two additional dps spell he gets in, on a 2 minute timer (though you wouldn't use it on cd, only in those heavy raid dmg situations). That's negligible. It really only makes surviving shit easier in the first place and it loses even more effectiveness with more gear, while the dps increasing utility of nin and drg gets even better.

[Kaisersoke]

It allows your healers to dps more, so it does bring value. its not meant to be offensive utility correct, but in this dps is everything metagame, anything that gives you "two globals" to dps matters. im not gonna argue that with you because its silly, its useful for healers. i didnt say mantra was better than trick attack, i said that monks brought it. usually when people desire certain classes, its for a progression group, of course mantra gets worse with gear, you probably dont need a heal increase by time you have fights on farm and are ilevel 205. monks bring mantra.

[CGMidlander]

monks are doing on average about 150 more dps than other melee, last i checked, 150 dps is a lot and by no means "just barely" they also bring traited mantra which does wonders in heavy raid damage encounters like as3.

You're pulling numbers out of your butt.
Leaderboards don't show a 150 dps average difference between drg and mnk. (Single target, anyway.)

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...wsLaoo/pubhtml
http://www.fflogs.com/rankings/7#boss=18

[MrCookTM]

You're pulling numbers out of your butt.
Leaderboards don't show a 150 dps average difference between drg and mnk. (Single target, anyway.)

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...wsLaoo/pubhtml
http://www.fflogs.com/rankings/7#boss=18

They don't even show a 150 dps difference between mnk and nin, lon. ^^ Well, at least in A1s and A3s they don't...

[whiskeybravo]

They don't even show a 150 dps difference between mnk and nin, lon. ^^ Well, at least in A1s and A3s they don't...

If you average the top 5 submissions -93.56 for a1s, and -107.66 for a3s in favor of monk

Have to remember TA doesnt only affect nin but the rest of the raid group including other dps, tanks and healers (if they decide to dps). So i dont think another 150 dps from monk will be enough to make up for TAs utility.

IIRC Trick Attack is about a 1% dps increase overall. If mnk does 100 more dps than the nin you'd have to have 10,000 raid dps for TA to catch up. Of course TA's contribution is situational, on a burn phase it helps more than 1%.

So, to the OP, yes MNK should very much be desired

EDIT: I redid the math and it's 1.6% increase if I did that right. Need 6250 raid dps for it to "equal" 100 extra monk dps. And really that's with perfect TA uptime, which is likely not going to happen in most environments.

[RocheKat]

Not 100% on this but I am pretty sure monk is in a very good spot for AoE dps which is something... of course I could be totally wrong.

[Aeliott]

Not 100% on this but I am pretty sure monk is in a very good spot for AoE dps which is something... of course I could be totally wrong.

Yes, monk has easily the highest potential sustained aoe dps (purification and elixir field are awesome). Just look at the A2S charts