Crafting is fun!

[Gilthas]

Now if only it could keep you from wasting time on the forums ...

Ah yes. I also wish when players like you started complaining about having too much competition on the MB when ARR was released that you guys had left too.

The game would be a lot more fun nowadays.

[Silverbane]

Ah yes. I also wish when players like you started complaining about having too much competition on the MB when ARR was released that you guys had left too.

Another complainer who resorts to wholey-fabricated personal attacks on people who disagree with them ... tsk tsk.

A "player like me" has never and would never complain about competition on the MB because I don't care much about gil. As long as I have enough for repairs and teleports, I am fine, everything else I can gather or make for myself (except fish, for which I rely on my wife). I craft because I enjoy crafting, not to become a gagillionaire. So I don't mind that end-game crafting is no longer a gil-minting machine for a small number of crafters. I was never in that company anyway.

[Lemuria]

I craft because I enjoy crafting, not to become a gagillionaire. So I don't mind that end-game crafting is no longer a gil-minting machine for a small number of crafters. I was never in that company anyway.

You kind of contradict your own point here. I too enjoy crafting, but the current system forces you to jump through a LOT of hoops just to get to that stage. If you're not a millionaire already, you have to gather all of the ingredients yourself which requires a LOT more work, most of which has nothing to do with the actual crafting. If you ARE a millionaire, your argument is moot.

Honestly, for me I was shocked just to discover that the requirements for the level 60 class quests often require you to have the level 3 recipe book, and a rather excessive amount of rare materials and high stats just to craft the items needed. You can't simply craft for the fun of it when these silly restrictions are in place. Without high level HQ gear and some extensive melds, you can't even get close to the first tier.

This was the same issue I had when they introduced 3-star and 4-star level 50 crafting, and it sucks. I have no qualms with them adding barriers, but they set the bar incredibly high. It's not a smooth curve as it should be, but a giant leap. They gave us meaningless specializations which I've never found a use for, and our level 60 crafting skill can only be utilized with a consumable item.

It's a horrible, and unjustifiable system. You simply can't defend it.

[Silverbane]

You kind of contradict your own point here. I too enjoy crafting, but the current system forces you to jump through a LOT of hoops just to get to that stage. ... It's a horrible, and unjustifiable system. You simply can't defend it.

Unless you like jumping through the hoops. Which, in fact, I do.

3.0 made gatherers more important to crafters. I'm both, and I'm fine with it.

[Lemuria]

3.0 made gatherers more important to crafters. I'm both, and I'm fine with it.

I too have crafters and gatherers alike, but in order to get to that level, you need to pretty much make gathering a full time occupation. The scrip gathering on miner/botanist is a terrible system, and don't even get me started on folklore. If you're one of those rare people defending the red scrips, then you have masochist written all over you.

Maybe I'm just old fashioned. I play to have fun. When it ceases to be fun, I cease to play along. What used to be a reasonably casual pastime is now the sole domain of the hardcore, requiring many hours of dedicated play just to get to a level where you can craft what ultimately amounts to glamor-wear. It's not like any of the stuff we can make is of any practical use.

[Silverbane]

It's not like any of the stuff we can make is of any practical use.

It's a video game. What has "practical use" in a video game? I guess that's subjective.

Is it practical to over-gear your crafting classes (for the current recipes) in anticipation of more difficult recipes that may come later? You can make stuff to do that.

Is it practical to craft DoL offhands (especially since there are no DoL scrip offhands) to improve yield and HQ chance on Ephemeral and Folklore noads? You can make stuff to do that too.

But if you restrict "practical use" to meaning "gear that's better than tomestone gear for end-game Savage progression," Yoshida-san has made it clear that they aren't going to let people craft gear like that any more, and why. His reasons are not bad reasons.

[Lemuria]

It's a video game. What has "practical use" in a video game? I guess that's subjective.

You're answering in rhetoric. Stop pretending not to understand what someone means by 'practical', it's not some mystery definition of the word, it's a very clearly defined descriptor.

We crafters craft for one reason. To make stuff for crafting. It's a circular cycle. There's no benefit whatsoever to crafting for Disciples of War, since the gear is outdated before it's even earned. Yoshida's reasons are as stupid as the concept of crafting for crafting's sake. There's absolutely no reason why certain items couldn't be bind on craft, nor any reason why such items couldn't be unsealed similar to FFXI abjuration items. For all the time and effort put into building a meaningful crafting system, they're sure eager to stamp on any embers that might become a lingering flame.

And what do we crafters get for our troubles? Walls. They're eager to throw constant barriers in our path towards reaching higher crafting skill levels, but there's no true reward for overcoming those barriers. We get a couple of extra recipes, but most of them are worthless. Our ultimate aim is really to craft our high level tools, but by the time we reach that level there's little point to having them.

Surely I can't be the only one who wants some meaningful progression? I enjoy crafting as a casual excercise. If I'm working hardcore to get to those high end crafts, you can be damned certain I want to see some benefits out of it. Not the pitiful returns we're currently being offered.

[Gilthas]

Another complainer who resorts to wholey-fabricated personal attacks on people who disagree with them ... tsk tsk.

A "player like me" has never and would never complain about competition on the MB because I don't care much about gil. As long as I have enough for repairs and teleports, I am fine, everything else I can gather or make for myself (except fish, for which I rely on my wife). I craft because I enjoy crafting, not to become a gagillionaire. So I don't mind that end-game crafting is no longer a gil-minting machine for a small number of crafters. I was never in that company anyway.

Guess what? I also craft because I enjoy crafting (and gathering) not because I want to make gil.

And that's why I'm complaining about the current system, because it's designed to force people to get supplies through the MB.

You're not a greedy crafter that wants to push everyone else out of crafting so they can jack up prices on the MB? Good for you! Now if only you stopped defending a system that forces most of the playerbase out of DoH and DoL because of ridiculous grindwalls and let everyone else have fun too.

[Silverbane]

I'm complaining about the current system, because it's designed to force people to get supplies through the MB.

Not true. I've crafted a few L60 2-Stars now, and will be doing a few more this weekend.
And yet I have not bought any mats off the MB for it, nor do I plan to.

So obviously, the system does not "force" people to buy mats off the MB.

Now if only you stopped defending a system that forces most of the playerbase out of DoH and DoL ...

Quit pretending you know things that you can't, please.

And times are pretty good for DoL from what I see. Time-gated mat prices have held at comfortable levels, even for L50 time-gated mats like Volcanic Rock Salt and Darksteel Ore. Even fleece still gets an OK price, so I usually KO a few Karakul with my pickaxe while waiting for the Darksteel node to pop. So why you would conclude that players are being driven out of DoL is hard to imagine ...
oh, were you just making that up ?