Does instant transportation effect game immersion?

[Crica]

People will play an MMO if it offers the options they enjoy.

The less options an MMO offers, the less people who will play it.

Options are a good thing for an MMO - it attracts more players.

Players who do not prefer to instantly teleport already have the option in the game to not instantly teleport - therefore the game already includes the option they enjoy.

Players who do prefer to instantly teleport already have the option in the game to instantly teleport - therefore the game already includes the option they enjoy.

Both options for both types of players are in the game - what is the point of this thread, exactly?

To ask Square to remove an option that is already in the game so players who enjoyed the option will want to stop playing the game once the option is gone?

I really do not think that would be a move Square would take since less players = less money for Square.

[Jobeto-Rin]

Ya you only read the last part which wasn't really the question only something to keep in mind when answering the question.

The last part was a disclaimer so that you didn't pigeon hole me as a post WoW gamer.

Here's the link to the entire post.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post328853

I intended to reference this proposal and question combination:

Anything that takes time requires us to be more involved
AFK on an airship involves me how again?

Waiting on an airship helps to substantiates it as being an actual in-game airship, it's an immersion tactic made to actually grant the feeling of progression, movement and traveling. Ya know things you do in a massive game world?

Apparently though....since immersion is flying out the window, tacts such as those doesn't matter, they'll only be seen as wasted time sinks.

Imagine just going to a dock seeing an airship / clicking on it / blank screen / arrived at the destination?

You went somewhere, but to some it doesn't feel like you went anywhere. It differs from different people. Some people become immersed others don't.

If you decide to go AFK well, obviously it doesn't.

That was going to be my response until I read yours.

We are different types of players and I concur that we do see MMO's under a different light.

I understand your view.

[Azurymber]

People will play an MMO if it offers the options they enjoy.

The less options an MMO offers, the less people who will play it.

Options are a good thing for an MMO - it attracts more players.

Players who do not prefer to instantly teleport already have the option in the game to not instantly teleport - therefore the game already includes the option they enjoy.

Players who do prefer to instantly teleport already have the option in the game to instantly teleport - therefore the game already includes the option they enjoy.

Both options for both types of players are in the game - what is the point of this thread, exactly?

To ask Square to remove an option that is already in the game so players who enjoyed the option will want to stop playing the game once the option is gone?

I really do not think that would be a move Square would take since less players = less money for Square.

right now the game has nowhere near the numbers to survive as an MMO. I think FFXI still has more players. Square has to step the game up and make it competitive to draw in a good 50,000+ regular players.

So now is the time to change things and redesign things.

Choice isn't always good if it will make reviewers say "FFXIV is an instanced easy-moded game which has little to no strategy, has no sense of immersion, and feels like an empty world"

[Jaber]

Instead they'll say "FFXIV is more like a movie than a game, since you'll spend more time sitting around than you will interacting with anything"

I don't know how people can complain about the game having an option they like simply because it's just that - an option.

[Bled]

Yes, please list them off for me. Only the ones where the forced waiting adds to the game, mind you, not the ones where you mistake being unable to skip things to be a gameplay element.
For example.. Final Fantasy Tactics Advance comes to mind as a game that would have benefited greatly from not having to sit through the halfhour long intro/tutorial. It was bearable the first time. It's kept me from replaying it ever again, though. Like an airship ride, not something I'd want to have to sit through multiple times whether I'm sick of it or not without any choice in the matter.

BTW, your argument boils down to "if people have access to content that's easier to enjoy, they're going to choose it over other content"
Which is really not much of an argument at all.

And I counter your Abysea with Chains of Promathia, which was an enormous pain in the dick to complete because very few people were willing to do it again after experiencing it once, even after level sync negated the requirement of buying new gear sets for 30, 40, 50, and 60! GL getting a group willing to do promyvions with you, let alone one that's capable of clearing it, even after spending hours farming for items to weaken the boss!

Human nature; present a caveman with magically cooked chicken that appears before him or force him to hunt, then kill, then find a way to cook the chicken. Of course the cave man would choose the magical cooked chicken appearing before his eyes, however guess what he had to hunt, then kill, then find a way to cook the chicken. So because the cave man had to take the hard road he learned more along the way like fire, hunting, skinning, bone craving, weapon making. Can you stop and even imagine where we would be today if everything was just given to us!?!?

Human nature is to take the easy way out so if you present game content that has easy content and hard content it is only natural for a person to choose easy content. In this respect people should not have any choice or say in the games development.

Edit: and again you are confusing your own impatiences for what immersion actually is.

[Crica]

right now the game has nowhere near the numbers to survive as an MMO. I think FFXI still has more players. Square has to step the game up and make it competitive to draw in a good 50,000+ regular players.

So now is the time to change things and redesign things.

Choice isn't always good if it will make reviewers say "FFXIV is an instanced easy-moded game which has little to no strategy, has no sense of immersion, and feels like an empty world"

Again, people will play an MMO if it offers the options they enjoy - it's that simple.

Right now, if people would like to play an MMO that offers the option to instantly teleport around the game world, then FFXIV is an MMO they would try out since FFXIV offers the option they are looking for.

Right now, if people would like to play an MMO that offers the option to not instantly teleport around the game world, then FFXIV is an MMO they would try out since FFXIV offers the option they are looking for.

If Square were to remove either of these options, then FFXIV would no longer be an MMO for half of the above players to try out...as well as turn off some of the existing player-base from wanting to continue playing.

[Jaber]

Human nature; present a caveman with magically cooked chicken that appears before him or force him to hunt, then kill, then find a way to cook the chicken. Of course the cave man would choose the magical cooked chicken appearing before his eyes, however guess what he had to hunt, then kill, then find a way to cook the chicken. So because the cave man had to take the hard road he learned more along the way like fire, hunting, skinning, bone craving, weapon making. Can you stop and even imagine where we would be today if everything was just given to us!?!?

Human nature is to take the easy way out so if you present game content that has easy content and hard content it is only natural for a person to choose easy content. In this respect people should not have any choice or say in the games development.

The flaw in your argument is that this is a game.
People don't play games to 'take the easy way out'. They play games to take the fun way. If the fun way is the easy way, okay. If it's not, that's okay too. In FFXIV, they will be able to choose the way in which they get the most enjoyment, and unlike in your example, they don't have any sort of threat pressuring them to go one way or the other. As long as the choice isn't affecting anyone but themselves, they can choose whichever they like, and if they choose to take the way that they don't enjoy because it's the "easy way", it's their own damn fault. It doesn't need to be forced for you to enjoy it.

In the end, no matter what they choose, the only prize is getting to their destination. It's not like an "LOL INSTANT LEVEL UP BUTTON EASY MODO". It's not a symbol of status to go to limsa from uldah. There's no epeen or achievement involved.
There's just "I want to/don't feel like looking at the scenery for 10-60 minutes, so I'll do this".

[Jobeto-Rin]

I have to add that for someone like me, my immersion would be immediately taken away once I realize I don't have to ride the airplane, it becomes less of a virtual world to me, simply because I can skip it.

That is incredibly hard to compensate for. A world's massiveness and immersion are affected when there are certain things being applied, like waiting for your plants to grow in FFXI. You had to wait, it helped to create that feeling of a live plant. It's the same concept with anything else requiring time.

I'd hate to imagine a skip button for that.

[Bled]

The flaw in your argument is that this is a game.
People don't play games to 'take the easy way out'. They play games to take the fun way. If the fun way is the easy way, okay. If it's not, that's okay too. In FFXIV, they will be able to choose the way in which they get the most enjoyment, and unlike in your example, they don't have any sort of threat pressuring them to go one way or the other, and as long as the choice isn't affecting anyone but themselves, they can choose whichever they like.

In the end, no matter what they choose, the only prize is getting to their destination. It's not like an "LOL INSTANT LEVEL UP BUTTON EASY MODO". It's not a symbol of status to go to limsa from uldah. There's no epeen or achievement involved.
There's just "I want to/don't feel like looking at the scenery for 10-60 minutes, so I'll do this".

The point went completely over your head, shall i try to explain it to you or am i leading a horse to water just to find he wont drink?

[Jaber]

The point went completely over your head, shall i try to explain it to you or am i leading a horse to water just to find he wont drink?

Is your new debate tactic saying things that are so completely irrelevant and stupid that it leaves people speechless?

If you had the option of riding the airship or skipping it, which would you choose?
Would you ride it?
Would you skip it?
If you would ride it, why is the option of skipping it a problem for you?
If you would skip it, why would lacking that option make riding it enjoyable?

I mean, I could understand if it were going to be either/or, but since there's going to be both options, how is it a problem for you if other people can choose not to do it the way you prefer?
I don't see anyone arguing for having the option of skipping it arguing against having the option to ride it, yet everyone who wants to ride it seems to be vehemently opposed to anyone being able to skip it.
I don't get it, and have come to believe that those people don't fully understand it themselves, either.