Bard - they broke my job

[seorin]

Even then, WM grants us a 30% damage boost so playing Ballad or Paeon only reduces the bonus to 15%. This is far better than doing -20% of our DPS back before the stance was added.

1) That's not how math works. 15% is still 15%. If you want to be pedantic, we deal 10.5% more damage with both ballad and WM up compared to using neither.

2) The DPS gap between BRD and other classes is the same as it was at 50 without WM. It's not a buff, it's an added mechanic we have to deal with to be as good as before. Without it we're worse than a BLM who ignores Enochian.

In short, BRD are giving up more than ever and receiving nothing in return. That's an issue even beside the more salient point that a lot of BRD players don't enjoy dealing with cast bars, and that's why they played BRD in the first place.

[SlyRoyale]

1) That's not how math works. 15% is still 15%. If you want to be pedantic, we deal 10.5% more damage with both ballad and WM up compared to using neither.

Hrm, a little lower than I thought it would be but it's still an increase.

2) The DPS gap between BRD and other classes is the same as it was at 50 without WM. It's not a buff, it's an added mechanic we have to deal with to be as good as before. Without it we're worse than a BLM who ignores Enochian.

The majority of the DPS jobs--if not all of them--have gimmicks added to them, too. DRG has Blood of the Dragon and Wheel/Claw, SMN has Dreadwyrm Trance, BLM has Enochain like you mentioned, and MCH has Gauss Barrel. As long as we make proper use of them, we should be where we were before.

In short, BRD are giving up more than ever and receiving nothing in return. That's an issue even beside the more salient point that a lot of BRD players don't enjoy dealing with cast bars, and that's why they played BRD in the first place.

They aren't giving up that much, frankly speaking. Sure, the clunkiness takes some getting used to, but it is adaptable and we'll have to bear with it until SE does something about it. The amount of damage we do is still decent. I wouldn't be surprised if there are BRDs who are breaking 1k+ now in any of the Alexander Savage fights with the current gear available. As for the people who played BRDs so they don't have to deal with cast bars, they still had to play songs during fights, and the cast bars we have now are very manageable. I just feel that people are making mountains out of molehills here.

[RiceisNice]

The majority of the DPS jobs--if not all of them--have gimmicks added to them, too. DRG has Blood of the Dragon and Wheel/Claw, SMN has Dreadwyrm Trance, BLM has Enochain like you mentioned, and MCH has Gauss Barrel. As long as we make proper use of them, we should be where we were before.

The additions that the classes have gotten either add onto what they already do (such as a 4th combo extension, enochian or stacks that build off from using your abilities) or filling in their short comings (monk's downtimes, healer and tank versatility). Bard, you really can't say something like WM was designed with 2.0 in mind when you're looking at their oGCD resets and even down to their animations.

Not to mention their skill is functionally the same as machinist, which really feels like a cop out since the latter was designed with it in mind. Having both at 60, they share nearly identical concepts of gameplay because of WM/GB being functionally the same; I feel that as a machinist, I'm changing lanes on the highway, whereas bard I'm going on a highway that has speedbumps. Like at that point, I'm not even playing machinist because of aesthetics (which was primarily why I wanted to switch when they were announced), but the fact that the two play similar to each other, but one of the two doesn't involve me having hiccups with my skill execution because of procs or haphazardly added mechanics that don't mesh.

[twoheadedenby]

Yeah, it's abundantly clear that WM is a Machinist mechanic that was retrofitted onto Bard far too late in the game. The synergy between MCH's procs/ammo loading and Gauss Barrel works wonderfully, and MCH attack animations are just a short burst by default to account for the cast bars without clipping half the animation off when you move to the next ability. If people want to trade mobility and fluidity for DPS that's fine, but they should be playing MCH if that's the case, rather than forcing Bards who can't or don't want to play casters to do so.

[Sacerdos]

How would people feel if Bard got Sniper Training from Marksman Hunters in WoW?

All your casts would be instant, but you only get WM's damage buff if you stand still for 3s and it falls off after 6s if you move and don't refresh it by standing still for 3s again.

[Greywolfamakir]

How would people feel if Bard got Sniper Training from Marksman Hunters in WoW?

All your casts would be instant, but you only get WM's damage buff if you stand still for 3s and it falls off after 6s if you move and don't refresh it by standing still for 3s again.

Sniper Training from MM Hunter in WOW is what SE should do by far.

+1.

[Kumori_Kumo]

All your casts would be instant, but you only get WM's damage buff if you stand still for 3s and it falls off after 6s if you move and don't refresh it by standing still for 3s again.

... That sounds like the way it should've worked in the first place, to be honest!

[Warlyx]

How would people feel if Bard got Sniper Training from Marksman Hunters in WoW?

All your casts would be instant, but you only get WM's damage buff if you stand still for 3s and it falls off after 6s if you move and don't refresh it by standing still for 3s again.

that would be a pain in the rear , just another buff to keep track of....plus rendering the whole gameplay based around it

if the buff worked more like if u arent moving u do 20% more dmg , if u are moving u lose that dmg , having to stand still for 3s everytime u move...ugh... just try it now and u will see...

Never reap : 1 boss , if u need to move totems , 2nd boss , move outside areas and back again to see the boss , 3 boss tornado everywhere!

and where it really matters,

A1S u need to move a lot , As2 not bad , As3 wont see the buff ever , AS4 no clue but guess is a heavy movement fight too.

[KaelDrakkal]

that would be a pain in the rear , just another buff to keep track of....plus rendering the whole gameplay based around it

if the buff worked more like if u arent moving u do 20% more dmg , if u are moving u lose that dmg , having to stand still for 3s everytime u move...ugh... just try it now and u will see...

Never reap : 1 boss , if u need to move totems , 2nd boss , move outside areas and back again to see the boss , 3 boss tornado everywhere!

and where it really matters,

A1S u need to move a lot , As2 not bad , As3 wont see the buff ever , AS4 no clue but guess is a heavy movement fight too.

The way you describe these fights makes it sound like blm would never even get a shot off. There is a lot more time to stand and take shots than you're describing.

[Duelle]

How would people feel if Bard got Sniper Training from Marksman Hunters in WoW?

All your casts would be instant, but you only get WM's damage buff if you stand still for 3s and it falls off after 6s if you move and don't refresh it by standing still for 3s again.

I could go for this, though this would involve the acquisition of a trait that does this at lv52 instead of an ability button. I'm fine with it but I don't know if the devs would go for it.