To all the flames on primal datacenter...

[Tokyozombie]

its always flames vs badders because Mael always gets the caves. and once we attack badders once, they don't leave flames alone for the rest of the game no matter how much mael is winning making flames retaliate. Flames on the other hand have this lets just defend and never attack mentality for some reason and this splits our forces a lot.

[Tokyozombie]

Ultros Clean Up Crew has most of the flame premades on primal. Unfortunately, the GC only follows directions a portion of the time or follows directions from poor strategists. As the GC with the least dedicated pvp population, is hard to break that, "Gonna smash 1st gc that touches us" mentality. I can only think of three appropriate leaders who consistently make quality calls off hand... makes it rough.

that's not true Behemoth does premade's everyday they just don't announce themselves as a premade like ultros does.

[Ditto]

its always flames vs badders because Mael always gets the caves. and once we attack badders once, they don't leave flames alone for the rest of the game no matter how much mael is winning making flames retaliate. Flames on the other hand have this lets just defend and never attack mentality for some reason and this splits our forces a lot.

That mentality is hilarious.

Oh Adder/Mael is camping our spawn?

RETREAT GUYS YOU'RE ONLY GIVING THEM POINTS BY DYING

Like we have somewhere to retreat to. 90% of the people who think they qualify to lead are just hilarious. And then a group goes to fight off the GC that is camping our spawn and people get all upset like we're just dicking around killing time at our spawn.

Ultros Clean Up Crew has most of the flame premades on primal. Unfortunately, the GC only follows directions a portion of the time or follows directions from poor strategists. As the GC with the least dedicated pvp population, is hard to break that, "Gonna smash 1st gc that touches us" mentality. I can only think of three appropriate leaders who consistently make quality calls off hand... makes it rough.

No, you're just the only premade that has to constantly announce it any time you're there.

[CeveArthu]

No, you're just the only premade that has to constantly announce it any time you're there.

[Februs]

This is just a bias from perspective. I play for Flames on Primal and I can tell you now that the most common thing spoken around the watering hole is that Adders and Mael have an alliance, and have had one since Frontlines capture. That's how long that bias has been around in the Flames community. From my perspective, you two seem to be constantly helping each other out, or blatantly gank spanking Flames. Even today, I've seen Mael completely ignore a node and tunnel vision Flames while Adders just back capped the Mael node that they ignored for an easy win.

Do I honestly think you guys have an alliance? No, of course not. Not unless you managed to break the game and find a way to talk to each other in-match. But does it seem that way? Yes. ALL THE TIME. Truthfully, though, its more than likely just grudge cycling. Adders seem to win an awful lot on our server, and Mael and Flames are left to compete for 2nd. A lot of people tend to get aggravated and tunnel focus one GC or the other out of spite. Which leads to a lot of people shouting in the chat box,"DON'T CHASE!" Either that, or people are just being dumb, which I see all the time from every GC in play. Nothing special. It just sucks to lose.

[Februs]

From my end, flames are typically the ones that make the most amount of stupid mistakes that end up throwing their lead and essentially, the game. Or retroactively do things that won't get them the win (like fixating on a GC).

I find this amusing, because I've heard the exact same thing (even down to almost being the exact same wording) spoken about both Mael and Adders.

I've yet to see one GC or another consistently win out in terms of "smart" gameplay. I've seen Adders tunnel focus a team so hard they've ended a match with 0 points. I've seen Mael blatantly allow a GC to back cap them on A's and S's just so they could keep fighting over a B. I wish I could say either of these kinds of things are rare, but they aren't. I don't think there's such a thing as a team that doesn't make stupid mistakes when it's a mash up of 24 random people. Pre-mades can help groups be "less stupid," but, outside of that, all I see is 72 monkeys running around throwing poop at one another, while the odd 2 or 3 try to get them on point.

If there's something unique about Flames stupidity, it's that we have a lot of new players, bots, and eso farmers (who are also sometimes bots), which is probably why are ques are only 5 minutes... but even then, the win/lose ratio I've been averaging doesn't seem to suggest that Flames make any more or less mistakes than Adders or Mael, and there's nothing unique about the kinds of stupid mistakes they all tend to make.

[Februs]

Unfortunately for the flames they are the weakest of the 3 gc on primal data center (although they do have really good premades pop up once in a blue moon) and it seems alot of em there have a mentality of "oh we not gonna win anyway so lets just fk up one of the other GCs".

...

Both adders (don't even try to deny it we've seen it happen to us time and time again and it was happening all weekend) and maelstrom do this. Its gotten to the point where we have to think twice now about advancing on flames when they have 2 nodes cause we always have to keep our heads on a swivel waiting for that inevitable pincer that the adders will bring if we make ourselves the center of the flames attention.
1.

This made me laugh, and is very true. but I've just as often seen the attitude of "oh, we're not gonna win, so lets just sit around and sing songs to one another," and those of us who like to try are like, "really guys? Really?" -_-; IF they even fight, it usually just comes down to whoever is on their doorstep, because they're forcing the issue and cultivating a grudge. It has nothing to do with alliances or back door deals.

I agree with your pincer comment too. You are right about it. I can attest that Flames often aim for the sandwich tactic; however, I can also attest to the fact that, if and when they do a pincer, it's almost always when the team is at least trying to win or still has some kind of resemblance to a team. Most of the pincers I've seen the flames do are usually against the 1st place team. That being said, I've noticed that not all of the GC's aim for that 1st place pincer.

Mael seems to aim for 1st when they pincer, unless already occupied elsewhere; however, a lot of the Adder hate that happens in the Flame camp comes form the fact that Adders, at least seem to, consistently aim to pincer the 2nd place team or the 3rd place team, and it leads to grudge cycling. I'm not sure if it actually is a common thing or not for the Adders, but I've never seen someone say, "typical cowardly Mael. Attacking the losing team for farm points." It's almost always, "typical cowardly Adders." I don't know if we just happen to notice it more when it's the Adders, or what, but the Pincer maneuver has definitely led to some grudges against the snakes which can lead to some focusing against them, especially if our team is guaranteed to lose, or has too many Debbie Downers to attempt a counter attack.

That being said, I, personally, have never seen that grudge extend beyond the end of a match. If there's Adder/Mael hate in the following match, it's because they did something new to piss off or bait the Flames in that match.

[Renewhm]

I've yet to see one GC or another consistently win out in terms of "smart" gameplay.
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I've been playing since slaughter and we've always been competitive, but we have also had an over-saturation of poor performance players and newbs just getting into pvp, but now we have eso farmers as well. That's definitely why queues are so fast for us. We have the most noobs still flooding pvp and a lot of eso farmers.

We're competitive, too, but we have a lot more new players than the other 2 GCs. Every week I'm around 40% win ratio and that's solid for not having many healers and mostly melee dps.

MAel and adder on any given game will do the same shit as our poor pug groups if they don't have premades.

[RiceisNice]

...

Collectively, I've seen flames throw more games when they've had a good lead than mael or even when I'm queuing with adders. Granted we do have our fair share games where we've never broken 200 points, but those are typically attributed to north spawn and opportunistic captures (against our favor), I can count maybe 1 time that we've essentially thrown a game with a good lead...and that's typically toward mael. It could have something to do with the time of the week too, Adder queues are pretty damn piss poor early in the week because of eso farmers.

Though I still get the "lets just get second place" mentality every now and then, and people actually bitched at me for trying to lead the group to 1st. I'm digressing though, getting second is just as bad as losing since it doesn't count toward any achievements, and the exp/currency gain isn't all that much more than third. Heck it won't even count toward the leader boards on lodestone because it only tracks first place and the win rate for it.

Second place?! That's a fancy word for losing! You didn't stick your landing!
Forgive me, my friend!
NEVER!

[EddardStark]

Actually, it is true. A quick check of the leader board at the end of the match rarely shows 8+ from the same server excluding Ultros. Confirmed by many of the players in kenka, the main ultros pvp ls. I didn't say others don't exist from time to time but ultros currently has the most active full premade parties.