Did Yoshi P messed up the relics Im trying to understand the meaning of this help me!

[Andevom]

You can have your cake and eat it, you just have to be willing to bake it.

Um...but if you eat the cake you don't have it anymore. That's kinda what that saying means.

[karateorangutang]

If you can point to even one fact that suggests that having obtainable long-term goals isn't casual friendly, you might have an argument. You say you can't see my point, but it's because you're looking in the wrong place.

You have this strange idea that relics can't be casual goals, or that by having them as such they need to be made redundant every update just because the new players will have to go through it all. Well, I have my relic. It took me one full year and two weeks to accomplish through casual play. Several steps were made easier since then, and new players obtaining their relic will have an easier time getting to the stage I'm at now. I'm totally fine with that.

You see what I'm getting at? There's no risk involved if you make the earlier steps easier to progress through. It remains casual friendly, and allows new players to 'catch up' as it were, while still keeping them relevant at high levels. There's absolutely no problem with condensing earlier steps so that people can get through it easier, but have that carrot on the end of the stick. Make them worthwhile, and make the current 'endgame' level upgrades challenging enough that you feel duly rewarded.

You can have your cake and eat it, you just have to be willing to bake it.

It's not a casual goal if someone has to go back and do previous content for no other reason than to play catch for a year that they didn't play the game. I don't how that is even an argument at all.

If there's no risk at all and its nothing but a time sink why would we force people to do it. That doesn't make any sense either.

Again just sounds like rampant bad business decisions.

[MageBlack]

There's absolutely no problem with condensing earlier steps so that people can get through it easier.

Just looking for hipster status "I got my relic before it was nerfed!"

[SkizzleofRagnarok]

Well whoever GM thats hear just know the disappointment of the "other" gamers here that want something to feel unique and not a handout. You can forward that to Yoshi P. Some things could have just been untouched when everything else is a huge mega nerf!

[Nadirah]

If you can point to even one fact that suggests that having obtainable long-term goals isn't casual friendly, you might have an argument. You say you can't see my point, but it's because you're looking in the wrong place.

I wouldn't call the gil sinks in the ARR relic exactly casual friendly.

If anything it encouraged RMT.

[karateorangutang]

Well whoever GM thats hear just know the disappointment of the "other" gamers here that want something to feel unique and not a handout. You can forward that to Yoshi P. Some things could have just been untouched when everything else is a huge mega nerf!

I think this thread is showing a lot, seems to me that the opinion that the relic quests are doing the wrong thing isn't what the general populace thinks. Yes i also know that the forums can't represent the entire player base, but it is a rather large sample size of it. Your simple rage at the game and developers isn't making any valid points either.

Additionally, we don't know what the new relic will be like. It's possible you could be getting your wish starting at the next weapon incarnation, however I find that to be extremely unlikely due to the content progression within this game. If that is your issue though then the relic is a mere symbol of your argument, and your greater issue is within a structure that is currently working and gaining acclaim from many outlets. So, your in the minority again.

[Assirra]

Well whoever GM thats hear just know the disappointment of the "other" gamers here that want something to feel unique and not a handout. You can forward that to Yoshi P. Some things could have just been untouched when everything else is a huge mega nerf!

I am going to give you a hint and then i am out of here.
If you want something to change you need a massive amount of players behind you to back you up.
Constantly using the words casuals and handouts as obvious insults, is not going to get you anywhere.
So far you have not brought up a single argument that doesn't include "casuals" "handout" disprect" or "FFXI".

[SkizzleofRagnarok]

Assirra: Just because a huge amount of white knights roam this forum does that by default mean you guys are right? I can right now get 45 people from my server that feels exactly the same to reply if I really ask them nicely? What will that prove? Will it still be that im assuming im intentionally insulting someone for beeing casual? There is a huge difference of just beeing a casual and a casual but thats for another discussion. Its still a handout you know this game gives handouts so why are you even lying to yourself and me about this part? Ofcourse its a disrespect since you are handing out stuff many players grinded for hard for free to another player base wich by default becomes a "casual" since for some strange reason if you check peoples replies we are all of a sudden hardcore and eliteist who wants this? Your hint doesnt work when you feel disrespected by SE and the Dev team when the player next to you gets the same stuff as you constantly for half the effort.
Its not the fault of the player next to you ofcourse but when the player next to you behaves and acts like they deserve it too thats when stuff is bad and you can clearly see how this handout mentality is accepted by people here. No you shouldnt get the relic for free. You want a relic get it like everyone else no handouts. Want an i200 weapon bad? Save your esoterics and get one want a shiny i200 relic grind it like everyone else no exceptions and thats how it really should have been. You are acting like I want everything in some horizontal progression. I'm asking the dev team to have one thing untouched is it really so hard to ask and demand? So ofcourse I see players as selfish in the replies here. Cause just because someone doesnt seem to have time and thinks they pay for a subscription they should have the same stuff as me and Yoshi P gladly serves it to everyone. So yes again it becomes a disrespect and treating players like this shows it colors eventually don't worry. You can get a huge player market to care about it too. How much you want to bet if you make a petitition online about this and start spreading the word you can get people to sign it? Nothing will happen though cause this is a business its all about money we already know this its just sad that its to the expence of the people who saved this game during the dark ages and the cost of its heart. I welcome you to FFXIV A WoW Communism Reborn 2.0 (still 2.0 since Heavensward is still a reskin) Where you pay for a subscription you get everything like the next guy just wait it out a few months.

[Ashkendor]

I tried to engage him and find out where his information about 2.0 into 3.0 relic is coming from.

There hasn't been any information released on the 3.0 relic at all, aside from the comment about consideration.

Can you at least wait then to continue this conversation? We will hopefully get a huge slew of new information as well as a 3.1 release date, once you have something substantial to argue with, come back and we can look at this with a clear head instead.

Honestly, there hasn't been any real conversation with the OP at all. He mostly just throws hyperbolic statements and strawman arguments around. "I know that the devs want it one way, but I want it THIS WAY! This game is going to DIE if you don't do it my way!" is basically what he seems to be saying in a lot of his posts.

So far you have not brought up a single argument that doesn't include "casuals" "handout" disprect" or "FFXI".

Don't forget WoW. He loves bagging on WoW. I think he thinks FFXI is the MMO gold standard.

Assirra: Just because a huge amount of white knights roam this forum does that by default mean you guys are right?

Doesn't agree with you =/= white knight.

Your hint doesnt work when you feel disrespected by SE and the Dev team when the player next to you gets the same stuff as you constantly for half the effort.

You're still taking upward progression way too personally.

I welcome you to FFXIV A WoW Communism Reborn 2.0 (still 2.0 since Heavensward is still a reskin) Where you pay for a subscription you get everything like the next guy just wait it out a few months.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry at this.

[karateorangutang]

Assirra: Just because a huge amount of white knights roam this forum does that by default mean you guys are right? I can right now get 45 people from my server that feels exactly the same to reply if I really ask them nicely? What will that prove? Will it boost your ego assuming im intentionally insulting someone for beeing casual? There is a huge difference of just beeing a casual and a casual but thats for another discussion. Its still a handout you know this game gives handouts so why are you even lying to yourself and me about this part? Ofcourse its a disrespect since you are handing out stuff many players grinded for hard for free to another player base wich by default becomes a "casual" since for some strange reason if you check peoples replies we are all of a sudden hardcore and eliteist who wants this? Your hint doesnt work when you feel disrespected by SE and the Dev team when the player next to you gets the same stuff as you constantly for half the effort.

I'm still having trouble seeing where SE disrespected you. You and noone else but you consented to their creative control when your purchased and subscribed to their licensed product. You have the absolute right be dissatisfied with their product, but at the end of the day creative control is not in your hands, and a change in methedology in the game structure would require a massive petition that, I would be inclined to believe, there would not be sufficient support for.

If you came here to vent for no other reason than to vent.... well then I guess mission accomplished.