Why not just make everyone a DPS?

[Anger]

In order to cater to the new age of no trinity in games like Guild Wars 2. Since Warriors are practically DPS anyway, why not just, make everyone a DPS? You just raise everyones defense a little bit and it'll play like one of those non trinity games.

We don't have any tank or healer checks just DPS checks so I don't see what the issue is.

[Alahra]

Part of the reason I think Guild Wars is boring is because it doesn't have a trinity structure. I'd be really upset if they moved to that.

[Cinicus]

The trinity system works when you use properly tuned combat mechanics and are not limited to PS3 standards. I mean look at ESO it is a trinity and works great AND every boss fight is NOT a circle room....

[Makeda]

You can do this, but it requires an entire combat engine redesign.

Guild Wars 2's fault is not the lack of a trinity. Guild Wars 1 lacked tanking as well (but had healers). The problem Guild Wars 2 has is that early on players figured out how to 'hack/cheat/gimp' the combat mechanics... and the devs response was to ignore the problems in their engine and just say "you people aren't playing it right".

Now... if you actually DO play Guild Wars 2 the way the devs talked about doing it in their pre-launch videos, the combat is amazingly cool and exciting. The problem is that it also makes what are now easy fights become suddenly complex and wipe prone.

Imagine if you could defeat every single boss and trash pull in FFXIV by standing in a corner, facing an angle where you couldn't even see the screen properly and often had 'seizure inducing flickering' going on because the camera was jerking around trying to figure out your location... so you all stand there... ignore all your moves except your first and second primary attacks, and everybody slots "Second Wind", while bringing no healers or tanks... and the only gear brought was gear that was made for Thaumaturge/Black Mages - even Ninjas and Dragoons wore that.
- Imagine if this worked, not matter WHAT content you did. Imagine that level of crazy broken hack, working.

Now imagine if SE's response when players figured this out was not a ban, not a patch, but instead telling us to "L2P right"...

Who do you think is going to "L2P right" if such an easy trick actually could clear everything from a level 1 quest to the final boss of Alexander?

- That is the problem of Guild Wars 2... And the tactic I wrote above is pretty much it now.

They do have a very engaging combat system, but you can cheat it, and they don't care...
- Back when my GW2 guild was active, we had a rule of no cheating the pulls and no skipping and our runs were amazingly fun. But they took 3x longer than PUG runs, and had a LOT of wiping.

So the problem isn't the lack of a trinity... the problem is AFK devs...

But building a no trinity game has to be done from the start. Doing it in FFXIV now is just too late.

Guild Wars 2 could have killed the concept of Trinity MMOs. They had the chance. One big patch about 4 months after launch to fix this would have done it. But they blew their chance, and they blew it shockingly hard... And that is coming from a major fan of the game...

[Makeda]

The trinity system works when you use properly tuned combat mechanics and are not limited to PS3 standards. I mean look at ESO it is a trinity and works great AND every boss fight is NOT a circle room....

In my opinion the games most like FFXIV in combat is somewhere between WoW and Wildstar. Both also trinity games. And I kind of feel that the reason it is not as hectic paced as Wildstar, the reason it holds on to some of the clunky WoW concepts like tab-targeting and cooldowns, is because it had to support console gamers that didn't have a mouse and keyboard. Just a few tweaks to the FFXIV engine could make it amazingly solid. It doesn't need a massive 'throw out the trinity' - it just needs a minor rebalancing of some of the math.

[repoe]

please stop responding to these threads , it seems like hes just trolling- fishing for responses any valid response given to disprove his arguments generates a new thread he creates to argue the prior remarks

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-better-always

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...g-the-trinity-.
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...everyone-a-DPS

[abzoluut]

It's funny because maximizing DPS is what makes a job more interesting. If you're a healer or a tank, healing or tanking come first. For tanks, it's using mitigation at the right times. We of course assume that the basics are all within the skillset of the player (snap aggro, group aggro, right opener for pull etc.) Other than that it's really only to learn the fight to come up with a solid CD rotation.

I really wonder why people think it would be more fun without having to consider respectable DPS.

[Sapphidia]

I really wonder why people think it would be more fun without having to consider respectable DPS.

It's not that black and white. The problem isnt that tanks don't find it fun to max their dps - it IS fun, it's part of optimising the class. The problem is that a lot of people who play tanks play it because they love the feeling of being tough and unkillable, and they like gear upgrades to feel like they're increasing their survivability and making them easy to heal.

The current FFXIV tanking meta has tanks tryign to get away with as little health as they possibly can, use DPS accessories rather than tank ones, and spend as much time as possible in DPS stances, forgo tanking debuffs like storms path/rage where possible, all in the name of max DPS. This is what feels UN FUN to me.

I want to do as much DPS as possible, yes, but I hate the feeling that I'm having to make a conscious decision to make myself harder and harder and harder to heal in order to do that. I'd much rather if optimising DPS was done via mastering a complicated rotation rather than making so many tradeoffs on the "power fantasy" that a lot of tanks prefer.

I'm sure most DPS players would hate it if they kept having to sacrifice huge amounts of crit or strength in order to stack Vitality for raiding.

[Anger]

The current FFXIV tanking meta has tanks tryign to get away with as little health as they possibly can, use DPS accessories rather than tank ones, and spend as much time as possible in DPS stances, forgo tanking debuffs like storms path/rage where possible, all in the name of max DPS. This is what feels UN FUN to me.

I agree completely. I wanted to play a tank not a DPS.

[Iagainsti]

To all you non-Warriors complaining:

I've been playing warrior since 2.0 dropped, lvl blk mage for pre xpac for pvp, haven't touched it since. Point is, I've done raids, ex trials, all the roulettes as a pre xpac warrior, I've done more inner beast combos than I can count, dropped defiance to ot or dps, everything a player who's made perfecting a warrior his game.

2 months ago, I received a whole new set of abilities focused around a new stance, new combos and synergy to master and explore.
Is it really aftecting you so much that you start a whimper thread about it for me and others like minded to play our new class to its max potential?