Something need to be done about BAD DPS.

[Hayward]

The only problem I have with this concept is it's resulting in dumb play (i.e. ignoring mechanics, needlessly eating AoE damage, etc.) in the name of doing more damage.

[Gilraen]

Then once again you force the healers to carry your bad DPS.

That is exactly what they wanted to get away from with all the DPS checks.

Actually, it's quite the opposite. Alexander Savage is balanced with healers DDing in mind. Square has stated this outright due to Final Coil groups having done just that to clear it within it's first week. Totally blew Yoshida's mind, that.

[Assirra]

Actually, it's quite the opposite. Alexander Savage is balanced with healers DDing in mind. Square has stated this outright due to Final Coil groups having done just that to clear it within it's first week. Totally blew Yoshida's mind, that.

Read the quote i was replying to.

"even if people die, not wipe, healers need to work harder"

That is once again punishing healers for bad DPS.

[sirDarts]

The only problem I have with this concept is it's resulting in dumb play (i.e. ignoring mechanics, needlessly eating AoE damage, etc.) in the name of doing more damage.

I am fine with people taking small amounts of avoidable damage to maximize their DPS.
I do that for example in Neverreap at the first boss, I push my damage macro (Cleric -> Bio II -> Miasma -> Bio -> Cleric), and don't care about the AoE till it finishes casting. The AoE does less than 20% of my HP, and I can easily heal that without any danger to anyone in the fight.

When you know the fight and trust your healer, you can easily do stuff like that.

[Sapphic]

When you know the fight and trust your healer, you can easily do stuff like that.

Or as I do,, if second wind is off CD, and AE does about what it heals for, ill stay in punching and self heal.

[Sapphic]

Read the quote i was replying to.

"even if people die, not wipe, healers need to work harder"

That is once again punishing healers for bad DPS.

Depends if they died to unavoidable damage. A DPS dieing to prey in A1S, isnt the DPS's fault (unless they popped B4B just before it targets 2, then it is the DPS's fault XD ). But if one DPS dies for whatever reason in Savage, might as well restart.

[Alkimi]

Actually, it's quite the opposite. Alexander Savage is balanced with healers DDing in mind. Square has stated this outright due to Final Coil groups having done just that to clear it within it's first week. Totally blew Yoshida's mind, that.

No it isn't. Not sure why so many people believe this.

Yoshida: Yes. Since all DPS jobs will be increasing up through level 60, it makes sense to have the white mage's DPS extend by a proportional amount as well. For development, such as with Bahamut's Coils, the development team assumes what the item level should be for general equipment on players when they clear a raid. They sum up the basic DPS for four DPS and tanks at that assumed item level and cut that by about 10-15% for the minimum clear DPS. Healer DPS is not taken into account when this is set.

Certainly for people who are at world's first level, their goal is to clear it at as low an item level as possible, lower than the one assumed during development. So if you look at the fight and figure out that if it's not numerically possible to clear with four DPS and tanks, you'll need to make up the gap with DPS from healers. Then when those publish clear videos and other people see the healers DPSing, they might think that healers need to be DPSing even though its a situation that only arose because their clear would have otherwise been impossible. While we could take this into account, and assume a different item level in the next update which would then make it impossible to clear even with the healer DPS, we'd eliminate this type of play for highly skilled players who use communication, items, and a high level of understanding to come up with those last second clears. That would be a tough decision to make, so I still think it should be up to each party's own plans.

This is also one of the reasons we decided to implement both a normal and savage version of Alexander. Once again, healer DPS was not included in the development team's calculation as it was for other jobs, so you should just think of healer DPS as a last way to get your overall party's DPS up to where it needs to be.

[Assirra]

Depends if they died to unavoidable damage. A DPS dieing to prey in A1S, isnt the DPS's fault (unless they popped B4B just before it targets 2, then it is the DPS's fault XD ). But if one DPS dies for whatever reason in Savage, might as well restart.

We were not talking about DPS being dead tough. The argument was if the DPS was not reached the fight should become harder. That is putting the responsibility of the DPS (doing enough damage) suddenly on the healers if the DPS fail their job.

You are only creating more and more lazy DPS that think "well healer better deal with this, i play my way".

[T2teddy]

Most people who perform poorly are just poor players and they always will be. There is no point in wasting time on them, give them a few chances tell them you are dropping them because they are poor players and move on. The only time you will have a chance to improve someone is if they are new. No point in wasting time.

Wow after looking through many of the threads you've posted in, I have to say, you have a very poisonous attitude towards inexperienced players...
As for your comment about poor players not knowing the Alexander mechanics when it released...how the hell were they supposed to know them if it was a NEW instance? Nobody did.

[Osmond]

Telling those who such at DPS isn't gonna help getting them better. If you want to find the 2% of players that know what they are doing have fun finding them, but the rest ppl needs to stop getting their hopes up. Maybe ppl just want to play how they want to play as they should be. It just seems that ppl are just too impatient in wanting to get ppl better instead of giving ppl time to learn how to play the job, learn how to play the mechanics, etc. It's not gonna help anyone other than that person getting bitter at everyone.