Hopefully Alexander/Savage will be 24 mans.

[Greven]

I can understand your point of view but instead of removing the 8 players endgame raids I'd suggest to add a savage versione of the next 24 players raid.

This because the 24 players, other than nearly impossibile to organize, are very impersonal. I like to do endgame with my close friends and I'd drop it if it needed 24 players.

[Nadirah]

Go take a look at wow and what happened in WoD when Mythic suddenly required 20 when heroic(previous hard difficulty before they added flexible raids in MoP) had only required 10 all the way back to Cataclysm.

Recruitment issues abound and top world first race guilds disbanding over it.

Bad idea.

[Velthice]

If 8 mans aren't your thing than 8 mans aren't your thing. 8 mans were designed for a different audience from yourself, and that audience has a blast with them. Fun is subjective. Who are you to say they're having fun wrong and should have that means of having fun taken away from them?

[Gallus]

I wiped more times in bone dragon than in T13.

I'd rather kill myself than seeing this implemented.

[Nektulos-Tuor]

If 8 mans aren't your thing than 8 mans aren't your thing. 8 mans were designed for a different audience from yourself, and that audience has a blast with them. Fun is subjective. Who are you to say they're having fun wrong and should have that means of having fun taken away from them?

They are already developing the 8 man. However I am asking the harder version to be 24-man. =)

I never asked for 8 man content to be removed. I want more dynamic content to the game and more content. Not just one type, indeed 8 mans are not for me. However that doesn't mean I want them gone or removed.

To me, 8 people content is pretty much just a group. Not even a raid. However then again groups in EQ2 were 6 people.?

Raiding should be harder and far more rewarding then just group content, IMO.

[Velthice]

I don't think you understand, I never said to remove them. Did I? <3

I said that we should be focusing as 24 man's as the main content because it would make the classes a lot more balanced overall. 8 man's means several classes will need redesigned. Bards in raids for example are a lot more valuable then bards in 8 mans.

I don't think you understand. If Alex was the casual 24 man raid, people would treat it like they do crystal tower and whatever the difficult 8 man raid is would become viewed as "the main raid"

Anyway it's a moot point since square already does a fantastic job of catering to both sides. If your complaint is simply that we aren't getting g the 24 man first, then I'd have to guess the reasoning behind that is the people who want the difficult 8 man stuff are the same people that likely to rushed to 60 and start gearing up already.

[Nektulos-Tuor]

I don't think you understand. If Alex was the casual 24 man raid, people would treat it like they do crystal tower and whatever the difficult 8 man raid is would become viewed as "the main raid"

Anyway it's a moot point since square already does a fantastic job of catering to both sides. If your complaint is simply that we aren't getting g the 24 man first, then I'd have to guess the reasoning behind that is the people who want the difficult 8 man stuff are the same people that likely to rushed to 60 and start gearing up already.

I feel like you don't understand what I mean. I want "hard" raids. <3

There are a lot more people who loved World of Darkness then Coils. Actually no. I am in Ilevel 175 already on my character and I really don't like 8-man content. Another assumption.

I am waiting eagerly for the real fun content, not the elitism brand. <3

Not saying I won't do 8 man content. However I find it boring that there isn't any real raiding in this game yet. Disappointing.

8 Person content though, is not raiding. Its not even x2 (12 players.) Its more like an advanced group. Might as well call it a squad, but it isn't a raid.

[Musashidon]

real raiding.

this discussion has been played to death.

simply put raiding is what the developers say it is. coil/alex is real raiding.

the number of players have no play in the matter.

[Velthice]

I feel like you don't understand what I mean. I want "hard" raids. <3

There are a lot more people who loved World of Darkness then Coils. Actually no. I am in Ilevel 175 already on my character and I really don't like 8-man content. Another assumption.

I am waiting eagerly for the real fun content, not the elitism brand. <3

Not saying I won't do 8 man content. However I find it boring that there isn't any real raiding in this game yet. Disappointing.

8 Person content though, is not raiding. Its not even x2 (12 man.) Its more like an advanced group. Might as well call it a squad, but it isn't a raid.

Well like I said, fun is subjective. I hope they add something that appeals to you in a way that doesn't intrude on any other piece of content.

[Nektulos-Tuor]

this discussion has been played to death.

simply put raiding is what the developers say it is. coil/alex is real raiding.

the number of players have no play in the matter.

Raid:
"Large Scale."
"Stealing, Looting"
"Sudden Attack."
"Warfare."

Squad:
"Smaller Group."
"Special Task."
"A small group of people organized in a common endeavor or activity."
" the smallest military formation."

It is /not/ real raiding. It is more like a Squad, down to the point of your a specialized group designed to go in and take down high level creatures with a small group. I am asking for real raiding. (Anything above 20 players.), that is hard and fun for me. If Crystal Tower was released before coils it would of been really hard as well. People probably couldn't of cleared it for a long time, especially if the gear wasn't so high.

it's a raid. like i said this has been played to death. but continue

Well if Alphinaud can consider 5 people an 'army' then I guess its fair you (and apparently the developers, because you quote them like the scripture, even though they have changed what they have said a lot of times.) can consider 8 people a raid. Maybe I can too???? Sorry, I had to make that joke.

I for one think it is a translation error.