Forcing us to the entire story quest to unlock the new classes is just bad business

[SpecialKK]

Ditto, except I come with valid points and everyone else just screams lore and story, except allowing people to play the new jobs doesnt effect the lore or story...it actually allows motivated new and returning players to actually want to progress in the story....but wait that can't be right...sorry back to the minds of the masses! Gate the game!

Well, there's a bit of an issue with what you are suggesting however. What you're suggesting is to allow new players (or returning players) to be able to play DRK/AST/MCN if that is why they want to play the game. Great. I have no problem with that. So now how do you do it?

First, we have to remove the "lore" gate of Ishgard, so the trainers for the 3 new jobs have to be placed outside of it (since only the Warrior of Light can enter Ishgard under special conditions). That's not too bad really, though I've not leveled each of the jobs to find out if their own storyline is tied to Ishgard or not. If it is, scrap it and change it so they are instead tied to Uldah(DRK vs PLD), Limsa (MCN), or Gridania (AST).

That really shouldn't be too difficult to do. But, wouldn't existing players complain? "I just spent $40 on this new game and you want ME to level up in an area that I already have spent the past year or so playing in?"

Let's say we brush that off. Who cares what the existing subscriber think anyway? If they're playing, they're likely to keep playing anyway. So now, to point two...

Let's start them at level 1. No need for MSQ. So how do you level? SInce you don't want to do MSQ, I'm guessing sidequests is out of the question too. How do you accomplish this? The dungeons are locked until you go through the story and they open up. So what? Get rid of this too? Should SE auto unlock a dungeon as you fate grind from 1-50 and hit their requisite level requirements? I mean, there's dependencies on these quests, which means there's dependencies on the actual code that allows access to them. No problem, just break every dependency that a quest for Sastash has, for example. Great.

Wait, but Qarn has dependency to Sastasha. No big deal, break that too.

But, Hauke has dependency on Qarn too. Oh crap, gotta break those too. And so on, and so on.

And now what if you have a new player who actually wants to play the MSQ and go through these stories? Now comes the difficult part, because you have to make sure that while you're breaking these dependencies for the non-story people, that you have to make sure they also work for those that DO want to do stories.

Basically, this is an endless cycle of broken quests and bugs that is waiting to happen.

[LineageRazor]

Well, there's a bit of an issue with what you are suggesting however. What you're suggesting is to allow new players (or returning players) to be able to play DRK/AST/MCN if that is why they want to play the game. Great. I have no problem with that. So now how do you do it?

First, we have to remove the "lore" gate of Ishgard, so the trainers for the 3 new jobs have to be placed outside of it (since only the Warrior of Light can enter Ishgard under special conditions). That's not too bad really, though I've not leveled each of the jobs to find out if their own storyline is tied to Ishgard or not. If it is, scrap it and change it so they are instead tied to Uldah(DRK vs PLD), Limsa (MCN), or Gridania (AST).

You were doing well up to this point! Beyond it, though... You seem to assume that wanting to play MCN/AST/DRK out-of-the-box is equivalent to not wanting to do the MSQ?

I think it's the other way around - players WANT to do MSQ (even if they don't like the story, it's pretty good exp), but want to do it AS MCN/AST/DRK. Or, at least have the option.

What a lot of people don't seem to understand is that while the three new jobs are a "reward" for completing Main Scenario content, they didn't HAVE to be, and that it probably would have been better if they weren't. The rewards for MSQ should have been more MSQ, along with the dungeons and raids that are unlocked over the course of that MSQ. There was no need to lump the jobs in there, too - jobs are something that you play as in order to accomplish the MSQ, they shouldn't be a reward for doing MSQ. I'm sure there's many a potential roleplayer out there who sees the game and imagines themselves as the brooding Dark Knight hero setting right the wrongs of Eorzea - only to learn that before they can live that dream they have to do most of the saving as some other job...

[MageBlack]

I see nothing wrong with giving players a goal to work towards. Just makes achieving it that much more rewarding. I think if they called these "advanced Jobs" that people might be more accepting of the gating.

[SpecialKK]

You were doing well up to this point! Beyond it, though... You seem to assume that wanting to play MCN/AST/DRK out-of-the-box is equivalent to not wanting to do the MSQ?

I think it's the other way around - players WANT to do MSQ (even if they don't like the story, it's pretty good exp), but want to do it AS MCN/AST/DRK. Or, at least have the option.

What a lot of people don't seem to understand is that while the three new jobs are a "reward" for completing Main Scenario content, they didn't HAVE to be, and that it probably would have been better if they weren't. The rewards for MSQ should have been more MSQ, along with the dungeons and raids that are unlocked over the course of that MSQ. There was no need to lump the jobs in there, too - jobs are something that you play as in order to accomplish the MSQ, they shouldn't be a reward for doing MSQ. I'm sure there's many a potential roleplayer out there who sees the game and imagines themselves as the brooding Dark Knight hero setting right the wrongs of Eorzea - only to learn that before they can live that dream they have to do most of the saving as some other job...

Its certainly the vibe that I get from the "other posters". Maybe I'm off on that, but like I said, that's the vibe that I get (that people just don't want to do MSQ to play DRK/AST/MCN)

Personally, I hate that the new jobs start at level 30. I mean, you start at 30 with a plethora of moves that you have no knowledge of and are having to pick up everything at once. I felt that the gradual progression of leveling from level 1 allows you to get a grasp of a previous skill before compounding on it.

Overall, I think SE had some questionable vision/direction in HW.

[AdamFyi]

Players should have been free to play through the 2.x Main Scenario with AST, MCN, or DRK, just as they can with any of the base classes.

The problem lies with how the Job was designed around, not because it can't - just like how Rogue was integrated.

The three new jobs were built around that; jobs. Soul Crystals dictate that you have to be at least level 30 to be able to equip it. The new jobs require their respective Soul Crystal in order to use them at all. Of course, they could have allowed players access to it once they got one class to level 30. However, that would require them to be unlocked at level 1 due to the nature of the other classes. Y'know, just like how you can unlock Rogue once you reach level 10, but will be slapped to level 1 when you get access to it? Therein lies another problem; you can't access these jobs without being level 30 first because they don't have a base class.

[Seryl199]

Final Fantasy players are no strangers to having new jobs locked behind progression. You have to get to a certain point in the game to unlock a new job, whether it's the ability to become that class, or a new character that is of that class, and it's a sense of discovery, that you've found something new in the world that you get to toy around with. Applying that same concept here, in Final Fantasy XIV, makes perfect sense to us. There's a separate camp of players that find this concept far removed from the norm.

Every step of the way, certain dungeons, quests, or Primals have been locked behind a certain degree of completion of the MSQ. It's never been an issue before. Once money becomes involved, there comes with it a sense of entitlement. I get that. You paid money, you want to get things for it. You do get all these things when you get the expansion, the game just requires you to reach a certain point to utilize it. Many of us are perfectly ok with that. Many are not. I don't think it stems from any sort of laziness, but rather expectations. From what it sounds like, a lot of MMO players aren't at all used to progression gating jobs. However, SE's decision with Heavensward was to treat it as an extension of 2.55, and I think it succeeds wildly in that regard, and that the MSQ requirement isn't so steep right now, considering incentives and EXP bonuses have been offered in the meantime. As this has become such a divisive point however, I can only hope that gates are treated carefully, and that new content isn't handled in such a way that will dilute the story simply for the ease of transitioning.

[Solaria_Luna]

The problem lies with how the Job was designed around, not because it can't - just like how Rogue was integrated.

The three new jobs were built around that; jobs. Soul Crystals dictate that you have to be at least level 30 to be able to equip it. The new jobs require their respective Soul Crystal in order to use them at all. Of course, they could have allowed players access to it once they got one class to level 30. However, that would require them to be unlocked at level 1 due to the nature of the other classes. Y'know, just like how you can unlock Rogue once you reach level 10, but will be slapped to level 1 when you get access to it? Therein lies another problem; you can't access these jobs without being level 30 first because they don't have a base class.

Yes that's why...they are JOBs NOT classes. (hence they do not even have a hunt log attached to them)[for example: Do you see a hunt log titled 'BLACK MAGE'? No? I thought so. The BLM hunt log is the same as the THM hunt log.]

I like the 48k exp I get after I get into Ishgard from the main story...it's such a change from the small token amount from the MSQ's before.

[Luvbunny]

I seriously do not get this uproar about "gating three new jobs" behind MSQ.... The actual MSQ is ridiculously easy to complete, and rather fast as well, and they give you boatload of XP. You are paying this game for CONTENT, and now you have more stuffs to do for months. All these complainers should just go back play other online RPGs with no main story line. I think WoW and Destiny is great for that, just do bazillion quests or contents that are repeated over and over...

[Galand]

Instead of sitting here crying why not spend the time getting good and catching up?? Its not rocket science, play the game

[Tuathaa]

I seriously do not get this uproar about "gating three new jobs" behind MSQ.... The actual MSQ is ridiculously easy to complete, and rather fast as well, and they give you boatload of XP. You are paying this game for CONTENT, and now you have more stuffs to do for months. All these complainers should just go back play other online RPGs with no main story line. I think WoW and Destiny is great for that, just do bazillion quests or contents that are repeated over and over...

WoW has no story line or main story line mmkay. Being a player since vanilla I can tell it has way more lore and in depth story than FF has. WoD is, and the direction the game went is the only reason I am playing ffxiv.