Your thoughts on Astrolgian so far?

[Ambivalence]

I dont know if people are special or just want thier cake and eat it too. AST wasnt supposed to replace whm or sch, but to be primarily a support class with some heals. For those who played FFXI it plays similar to RDM, where your primary role is to cast support spells while throwing a few heals when needed to give the main healer a little relief. If people would stop assuming AST is weak and accept the fact that they are primarily a supporting class then we can all just get along.

There is no spot for support as a healer - A dps can fill that role (BARD). If the buffs were stronger I could see it, but at this point there is no reason to bring an AST in place of a WHM and to do so would be a waste since SCH can dps with a WHM main healing. SCH will need to focus more on healing with an AST in order to keep the group from wiping as is. WHM/SCH is still far and away better than any AST combo... I get your point, but AST has no place in current state.

[SenzorialBoundries]

There is no spot for support as a healer - A dps can fill that role (BARD). If the buffs were stronger I could see it, but at this point there is no reason to bring an AST in place of a WHM and to do so would be a waste since SCH can dps with a WHM main healing. SCH will need to focus more on healing with an AST in order to keep the group from wiping as is. WHM/SCH is still far and away better than any AST combo... I get your point, but AST has no place in current state.

I aggree with you i see no way an AST could replace a SCH or WHM, replacing sch you loose too much , supervirus, soil , covenant and replacing whm you will lose too much aoe healing power making the sch heal instead of helping to dps and push the fight faster.

[RageForOrderX]

I imagine that when we see ASTs at 60 with skilled players, we'll see they have a place among WHM and SCH. I imagine that, in terms of 8-man groups, the true test will be for an AST to know how to work with WHM or SCH - hopefully never another AST. This will go beyond knowing Nocturnal v Dirunal, but how to optimize the other's role while supplementing their weaknesses.

Such as getting either to DPS, supplementing AoE heals for SCH, and covering for tank busters with a WHM. All the while keeping card buffs up and extending them.

[GideonHighmourn]

Anything an AST can do, a SCH/WHM combo can do better or more reliably. With the massive mitigation options SCH has gained, combined with their DPS, and the raw healing power WHM, nothing an AST combined with either WHM or SCH can match. Yes, AST has some awesome utility options; however, it's random. If you line all the benefits up, it looks awesome on paper, but they can't offer those benefits on demand. Only one party member can benefit from AST at a time, and only once every 30/60~ seconds.

Eventually, when out gearing content, perhaps AST will show more usefulness. However, in the interim, you're either giving up throughput from WHM or DPS/utility/mitigation from SCH in order to have an AST in your Full Party. AST needs to be able to stance dance, acquire more reliable utility, or be equivalent to WHM/SCH in terms of either DPS or throughput in order to warrant a position over WHM/SCH.

[sharazisspecial]

I imagine that when we see ASTs at 60 with skilled players, we'll see they have a place among WHM and SCH. I imagine that, in terms of 8-man groups, the true test will be for an AST to know how to work with WHM or SCH - hopefully never another AST. This will go beyond knowing Nocturnal v Dirunal, but how to optimize the other's role while supplementing their weaknesses.

Such as getting either to DPS, supplementing AoE heals for SCH, and covering for tank busters with a WHM. All the while keeping card buffs up and extending them.

The problem is AST can't really out skill the card mechanics. The long cool-downs on card drawing and shuffling, along with royal roaded buffs requiring 2 cards means minutes spent trying to get a certain combo.
If your unlucky enough to keep drawing Bole,Spear and Spire when noone needs these buffs, then you've not really contributed enough to warrant the loss of WHM or SCH.

[Yumi_umi]

Almost 60 and have been healing every dungeon up to and including vault, imo its really tough trying to dps as an ast. It takes A LOT of effort to utilize/ manage ur cards during boss fights. Like buffing a high dmg monk or drgn with enhanced balanced + time dilation = op or add tht mini huton etc.
i tried this a few times in old 8 man content and its pretty hard to not play it like a whm. Often you will find urself neglecting the cards " as u r focused on healing & dpsing "

In end game raid content, there might be too much to look at for ast players.
- mechanics
-party hp
- ur positioning
- tanks hp
- status ailments
- cards/ card combos
- trying to dps properly with the 3 dots u have ( combust 1/2 & aero)
- stance dancing

Failing any of these will easily make u inferior to whm or sch = y bother bringing a half baked support healer.

Also the rng in the cards add another level of difficulty.

[RageForOrderX]

The problem is they can't really out skill the card mechanics. The long cool-downs on card drawing and shuffling, along with royal roaded buffs requiring 2 cards means minutes spent try to get a certain combo.

Yes, there will always be a random aspect to it. You won't be able to pop damage reduction whenever a big hit is coming. But, think in reverse.

An AST has to be so aware of the field that, whatever their card is, they know how they can best utilize it in the next 15 seconds. Combine that with keeping a mental note of what effect you're going to have from what you just RR'd, most of the time there will be SOMETHING you can do with the card you just drew, and getting it to the right target at the right time requires skill.

[sharazisspecial]

Well draw Bole, Spear and Spire over and over then it doesnt matter how "aware" you are.
RR isnt hard , its just memorization...

Bole and Balance , Affect damage straight up. B and B. RR is potency
Spear and Arrow - weapons, RR is AOE.
Ewer and Spire, reduce costs of resources-duration.

When it comes down to it. Duration and Potency have a negligible difference.
AoE is the strongest when your in an 8 man.

[Yumi_umi]

Also another problem i notice is,
Your co healer 9/10 times have no idea what u are.
Ik its early access but i see schs and whms trying to figure out how to play with u.
Often they will treat u like their opposite, whm-> sch & sch -> whm
Expecting u to fill in the other role which is kinda hard as we cannot shield or heal like the other.
If a sch makes u heal like a whm then ur going to go oom trying top off ppl/ tanks. Regardless of using ewer / enhanced/ extended + dilation. Other times whm will be like its k let me heal the majority but then they expect shields to help mitigation. Which is hard as we only have bole, noct shields & disable.
But once again card rng makes it hard to get at the right time.

[Mhikail]

I dont know if people are special or just want thier cake and eat it too. AST wasnt supposed to replace whm or sch, but to be primarily a support class with some heals. For those who played FFXI it plays similar to RDM, where your primary role is to cast support spells while throwing a few heals when needed to give the main healer a little relief. If people would stop assuming AST is weak and accept the fact that they are primarily a supporting class then we can all just get along.

I think it's a mix, probably a trial and error to see how a 'more' supportive type would work in-game.
This is why it's a little eh...they aren't good at everything. They are jack of trades.
A full fledged support will not work here...what we have here is a hybrid...like BRD...And I guess MCH.
It's more Support than it is healer.
But this patch BRD is more DPS focus but I digress.

I dunno how 8 man's are but I think people are more concerned about raiding.

- IMO I feel like they need to interact more with the cards. Bump the Draw thing to like 20/25 seconds or something.
- Please stop letting us draw the card we already have. In lore, yes I will use lore, we gained 6 cards, no reason why we somehow have duplicates.
You know how many times I try to get rid of Spire!?

30 is so damn long for the little time buffs we get. I can't wait for a guide or something.
I don't think I'm playing it right. I wanna use my cards a lot more but when I wanna buff them I'm putting them
in RR, then 30 sec CD, and waiting... >.<