Why not abolish the Class system entirely in favor of Jobs? [@ Devs]

[TheVedis]

The problem with that Ronik is the selling point of the game changes completely.
Also, by "forcing" jobs on people, you go against what Yoshi has stated to begin with, how no one will lose their progress due to changes

an option al job system(which is what we are getting) goes right along with what hes stated
we get to keep what we leveled, and add on to it if we so choose


there is really NOTHING wrong with the classes we have now, especialy since they are working on diversifying the classes in themselves on top of the addition of the job system

[Ronik]

The problem with that Ronik is the selling point of the game changes completely.
Also, by "forcing" jobs on people, you go against what Yoshi has stated to begin with, how no one will lose their progress due to changes

an option al job system(which is what we are getting) goes right along with what hes stated
we get to keep what we leveled, and add on to it if we so choose


there is really NOTHING wrong with the classes we have now, especialy since they are working on diversifying the classes in themselves on top of the addition of the job system

I will address your points seperately:

For one, this game has changed so extensively in both design and direction that you can't really pull the "selling point" card. It will continue to radically change right up to the PS3 release, and everyone who is playing the game at this point both expects and understands that drastic changes ARE happening.

Secondly, nobody is losing progress because of this change. If you levelled a class to R50, you will have an R50 job after the switch. The only change is that you will have a more specialized set of abilities and your fancy name will be replaced by a traditional Final Fantasy job name. In some cases, the classes will barely change in the transition from class to job (Pugilist to Monk would be largely similar, as would Paladin to Gladiator and Marauder to Warrior). Again, nobody is losing any progress with my change.

Right now there is nothing wrong with the class system because it is the only system. Once we have a job system added on top of it, we are significantly over-complicating combat roles. We simply do not need two layers of combat roles which perform vaguely different tasks at any given time. We should keep things simple with the tried-and-true approach of having a clearly and solidly defined job system.

[Gennosuke]

Dang, i just wrote up a thread stating pretty much the same thing just a few mins ago haha.

I agree completely with OP. I just hate the idea of keeping classes and think it's completely redundant and really is just a relic of the past they are holding onto.

Bring back the Traditional jobs as they always have been in all FF's and add subjobs onto it to address cross class issue.
It works, its fun.

Im very troubled with this plan, i think it's a wrong decision. It just doesn't feel or sound right and will only cause further complications when it could very simplified and fun.

I hope they take this thread seriously!

[Bittereye]

I think it's so funny when you guys label Thaumaturge as a Black Mage and Conjurer as a White Mage. Banish I and II are White Mage spells but they are in the Thaumaturge arsenal. The flipside to that is the DoT's that the THM currently possesses are BLM spells. The Conjurer has all of the Elemental DoT's and DD spells, Fire, Water etc which are BLM spells. However, CON has the healing spells. THM and CON are a mix of both BLM and WHM together. In their current state they cannot make the name changes unless they move spells around. BLM should have Elemental spells, elemental DoT's, Bio etc. WHM should have your light spells like Dia, Banish, Healing spells and buffs.

[Seif]

I think it's so funny when you guys label Thaumaturge as a Black Mage and Conjurer as a White Mage. Banish I and II are White Mage spells but they are in the Thaumaturge arsenal. The flipside to that is the DoT's that the THM currently possesses are BLM spells. The Conjurer has all of the Elemental DoT's and DD spells, Fire, Water etc which are BLM spells. However, CON has the healing spells. THM and CON are a mix of both BLM and WHM together. In their current state they cannot make the name changes unless they move spells around. BLM should have Elemental spells, elemental DoT's, Bio etc. WHM should have your light spells like Dia, Banish, Healing spells and buffs.

Once I learned that in XIV I thought it is as an absolute heresy to the legacy of the entire franchise. BLM characters have always been my favourite characters but in XIV there is no BLM nor WHM just 2 shades of grey...

[Dargoth_Draconia]

I think it's so funny when you guys label Thaumaturge as a Black Mage and Conjurer as a White Mage. Banish I and II are White Mage spells but they are in the Thaumaturge arsenal. The flipside to that is the DoT's that the THM currently possesses are BLM spells. The Conjurer has all of the Elemental DoT's and DD spells, Fire, Water etc which are BLM spells. However, CON has the healing spells. THM and CON are a mix of both BLM and WHM together. In their current state they cannot make the name changes unless they move spells around. BLM should have Elemental spells, elemental DoT's, Bio etc. WHM should have your light spells like Dia, Banish, Healing spells and buffs.

CON was meant to be the healer, but they are the elemental nuker as well so I see them as WHM/BLM. We have been saying that for awhile, THM resembles RDM and DRK(spells portion only).

[zaviermhigo]

CON was meant to be the healer, but they are the elemental nuker as well so I see them as WHM/BLM. We have been saying that for awhile, THM resembles RDM and DRK(spells portion only).

I think in the original vision for the game both CON and THM could nuke/heal. This is pre nerfs, pre yoshi-p, it was about letting you choose which mage class you wanted and then choosing how you wanted to play it. I do agree THM was more like an enfeebler lets says with its abilities. Then enfeebles were kinda lame or maybe we weren't used to them at first, and the range was better so people went to THM for healing. It was just a product of how we always take advantage of stuff. Personally I'd like to see the range thing go away (the differences between ranges) have conj be a healer but make enfeebles more potent, actually make them just last longer and less potent. buffs maybe less potent and last 10 mins. But maybe a job system will provide stuff like this :/

[Yoji]

Sorry for bump, I don't really have time to go over every post either so forgive me if I'm repeating some stuff.

My point: Does the class system restrict future jobs?

As we all know, jobs are based on classes, with around 5 new abilities/spells, AF and stat adjustments.

A new job branching from base class would therefore be similar, but some different spells/abilities, AF and some stat adjustments.

This worries me as jobs based on class will not be unique enough and class will always be holding back what can be done with jobs.

For example: Paladin << Gladiator >> Dark Knight

Unless Dark Knight was a tank, I can't see how this would work as Gladiator does not really have the right tools to be effective DD.

The class system was a nice gimmick but was not introduced the right way in order to be useful in the direction this game is heading. I suppose it still has some potential for solo play.

I doubt anybody would miss or even uses classes any more (except for a few fights). I personally would rather have interesting jobs as they have more flavour.

[Kallera]

Sorry for bump, I don't really have time to go over every post either so forgive me if I'm repeating some stuff.

My point: Does the class system restrict future jobs?

As we all know, jobs are based on classes, with around 5 new abilities/spells, AF and stat adjustments.

A new job branching from base class would therefore be similar, but some different spells/abilities, AF and some stat adjustments.

This worries me as jobs based on class will not be unique enough and class will always be holding back what can be done with jobs.

For example: Paladin << Gladiator >> Dark Knight

Unless Dark Knight was a tank, I can't see how this would work as Gladiator does not really have the right tools to be effective DD.

The class system was a nice gimmick but was not introduced the right way in order to be useful in the direction this game is heading. I suppose it still has some potential for solo play.

I doubt anybody would miss or even uses classes any more (except for a few fights). I personally would rather have interesting jobs as they have more flavour.

I'd rather have classes focus more on solo play. Give the player more versatility. You ever level that job that just does
not seem take on the mobs solo? In ffxi it was the monk or the whm, even classes that could depended heavily on what mob they were fighting.That's where classes come in.

[Daku_Naito]

I like it because it reminds me of past FFs, plus it allows for more combinations for jobs. For now, each class has one job to go into, it will change soon. Also, no reason to abolish something that there is nothing wrong with.