New glamour dress on a male (art)

[Ymal]

Am I the only one that doesn't understand how altering gear to female>male is apparently impossible but male>female causes no problems? Can't they create a model for both like they must have done for every other gear in the game that isn't genderlocked?

No? Anyone else..?

[Corfish]

Am I the only one that doesn't understand how altering gear to female>male is apparently impossible but male>female causes no problems? Can't they create a model for both like they must have done for every other gear in the game that isn't genderlocked?

No? Anyone else..?

I find it odd too. You would think needing to support breasts would be the harder transition with armor. I don't know anything about 3D modeling though, so who knows. Either way, I think it's a BS excuse lol.

[DracotheDragon]

hey guys, i hate to be a bit rude but cut out the random tangents and do not compare this to [insert horrible IRL thing here] it has happened once before and as the Moderator enkrateia said:

Greetings, all!

You may notice that the thread has gotten a bit slimmer due to moderation. If you would like to discuss gender-specific clothing or new gear that has been announced, you are welcome to do so in a non-derogatory and inflammatory manner. However, should this thread continue to choose to engage in a discussion that is derogatory or inflammatory, account actions may be issued and the thread may be closed. Please continue to discuss the original topic in a civil manner.

LGM Enkrateia

If you want to keep putting up a case on cross dressing men or clothing equality PLEASE keep it civil, other wise this thread gets locked and your chances of getting equality in the dress goes down the loo.

(just posting this up here due to the fact i am seeing a repeating trend of posts from when this thread first got the chop.)

[Samcaesar]

[QUOTE=kyuven;3011560] Snip /QUOTE]

It's not hard to realize "Bonding ceremony" is marriage. If the stockholders were going to leave because of men in dresses, they'd leave with all those skirts, the pareos, and other effeminate clothes men could wear. I really doubt they actually care.

US culture has expectations for their pop idols too, remember the whole Britney Spears incident and her caving in from the constant pressure? I'm sure Japan has celebrity tabloids as well, I'm sure Schadenfreude is something that happens in Japan as well.
Japan isn't a hivemind, there's plenty of people who participate and support subcultures, just as SE did with their addition of "Bonding ceremonies"
Subcultures are formed out of collective similar interests, particularly ones that aren't mainstream. I'm sure there's plenty of gay people in Japan who don't "Grow out of it", because again, they're not doing it to rebel, they just like people of the same sex.
That's the same sort of thing with folks in the US, those with more traditional conservative thoughts will see those apart of the subculture as folks who will "Grow out of it", turns out, I'm sure in plenty of cases, they don't.
Heck the model Kayo Satoh apparently got more famous after she told people that she was transgender.
What about all those middle-aged Japanese men making comics and cartoons or the anime industry in general? I'm sure Oda isn't looked too positively upon for making a living writing Shonen manga for young kids. Anime certainly isn't mainstream culture, look at the way people look at NEETs or Otakus, yet it's still a business people make money off of.

It's a dress and stockings, I'm not sure how it isn't a feminine outfit as I don't tend to see men in stockings or dresses that go to their mid thigh. Considering how those stockings are available, why aren't the fishnet ones? They're hardly any difference visually.
Those skirts in the game that are available aren't changed at all, the same could literally apply to every outfit in the game, SE just changes some of them on a whim.
Also, funny you bring up Kilts, take away the weird bag and belt, and it's literally the same cloth wrap.
Men can have several frames, I know lots of dudes who buy "women's" clothing simply because it fits their frame better, likewise, I know plenty of women with broad shoulders who end up buying men's shirts. Clothes is only gendered because it's made for the "generic man" or "generic woman" and made to fit that frame. It fits more often with those with men due to the way frames general go. You could make a dress that fits the "Generic male frame" without loosing all the things that are also on the "generic female frame" look at what the OP did for a fantastic example.

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You said "This game isn't made for fanservice" when this game is layers upon layers of fanservice of a variety of forms.

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Ooh lovely! Nice job yet again, as a lovely and supporter of Roegadyn to the second highest degree, wonderful job.

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Again, "examine why you think something is ugly" is the key here, it's important, because a false sense of morality is commonly a reason for that. Seriously it's like looking at something like Oktoberfest and going "Oh that's just dumb" whenever I'm sure you participate in similar things that are "equally dumb". I honestly think the OP did a wonderful job of even making the dress work with the Roegadyn figure without dropping all senses of it as a dress. Is it really ridiculous to ask for this, when they've shown Hildebrand in the dress? Or made it so the Christmas set was wearable for both men and women? Or all those skirts and pareos? The key difference between that request and this request if you're asking them to make existing changes to gear that some people might wear already (And making it something SE can't and hasn't done yet), while this thread is asking SE to make the dress available for men, considering all the other situations where men have crossdress in the game before and now it suddenly looks like the Devs just don't want to do it this time for some reason.

Snip .

Aeyis's point is very much so an extreme, but hardly a fallacy, it's "Both of these things have been the norm for thousands of years, and the US specifically has a huge and notable history with slavery that people tie them too, so saying "It's such a US thing" isn't a misnomer any more than saying "Slavery is a US thing" is" see my next paragraph.

The US has an incredible Hyper-masculine/Hyper-feminine phenomenon going on that's been going on for a long while, it's not exclusive to the US, but we definitely have some heavy and important issues in this country. Seriously, look at how many people freak out whenever they're boys who have long hair or wear pink, why? Because it's "Something only girls do!" when they ignore the fact that there's several cultures with men having long hair or that pink used to be a "boy's" color til (iirc) the 50's. Seriously, google the term "toxic masculinity" and read up a bit, it's not US specific, but it's very prominent in the US.

Gendered clothing has existed in cultures for a long while, though I wouldn't say thousands of years as people living in subsistence situations hardly have time to care about fashion and probably wore similar outfits to begin with, but that's been fluxing constantly, look at how heels became an upper class Men's wear thing to now something only women "Should" wear. Heck, look at that traditional belly dancer garb someone linked, note how similar the outfits look?

We're not getting your "man-dress" because people keep coming in the thread and going "Lol no, I don't like it so it shouldn't be a thing" without providing any substantial argument for their case outside of "I don't like it therefore it's morally wrong" for their reasoning.

Plus, you're the one saying "They probably failed history class" which is ad hominem, it's not like you don't use fallacies as well.

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Reasonable, though tangents aren't the problem it's people getting heated up and throwing insults at each other.

[Mugiawara]

Slavery was also a worldwide thing that was the norm for thousands of years.

This is why people are starting to get mad with comments like this.
Because you wanna compare SLAVERY and someone said Child Porn?
Wooooow, at the end of the day, it is clothes on a video game guy.
Just stop. I'm almost offended by this post.

[Samcaesar]

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He's not comparing gender clothes to slavery, he's comparing "Gendered clothes are such a US thing" to the claim "Slavery is such a US thing" which is something that people definitely do.
Why aren't you guys offended when the guy who said "Men wearing dresses is akin to some guy watching child porn" or the other one calling "Men who wear dresses are degenerates" but getting offended suddenly whenever someone gets offended at that statement?
It is just virtual clothes on a video game guy, so why are those comments okay, but those responding to them are not?

[Mugiawara]

He's not comparing gender clothes to slavery, he's comparing "Gendered clothes are such a US thing" to the claim "Slavery is such a US thing" which is something that people definitely do.
Why aren't you guys offended when the guy who said "Men wearing dresses is akin to some guy watching child porn" or the other one calling "Men who wear dresses are degenerates" but getting offended suddenly whenever someone gets offended at that statement?
It is just virtual clothes on a video game guy, so why are those comments okay, but those responding to them are not?

None of these comments are okay. Not one.
Everyone is literally at each others necks to prove points over clothes but no one is doing anything but hurting peoples feelings.
I'm honestly shocked how, hate to say, toxic this whole thread has become.

[Terrini]

Many will disagree with that :P

I was totally Going to post that too in response to "A robe is not a dress" xD

But really, more options is alway better.

[Samcaesar]

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I'm just pointing out that when most people bring up "God this thread has become so hateful" they cite posts that point out some toxic behavior while entirely ignoring the other ones (At least until they're brought up) which are far more toxic (IMO), like note how one person said "This is why you guys aren't getting your man-dresses". I'm not sure what's so toxic about bringing up slavery, it's an extreme for sure but I think a lot of people in this thread are misinterpreting what that guy meant. He never said "Slavery and gendered clothing are the same thing" nor did he say "You're basically saying you'd love to enslave people, kay~". Can you explain to me, please, why what he said is so toxic?
It's had it's issues, but I really don't see how that guy is at the other person's neck for making a misunderstood statement (Whether that statement is misunderstood on their end or the readers I'm leaving ambiguous), it's not really an insult or them being rude. Either way, they've done some pruning in the past with this thread, and while I haven't gone back to check, I'm fairly sure I know which posts would be pruned at a cursory glance.

[Galdous]

None of these comments are okay. Not one.
Everyone is literally at each others necks to prove points over clothes but no one is doing anything but hurting peoples feelings.
I'm honestly shocked how, hate to say, toxic this whole thread has become.

That was probably the goal of the creator of this topic. He is just wanting to bring politics and gender identity issues into a game. He can make a female toon at any stage of his gaming career and have those outfits but wants to bring politics into a game.