Quote Originally Posted by Izsha View Post
Quote Originally Posted by Gyson View Post
I feel like both of you are, perhaps, new to MMOs. And I define "new" as someone who hasn't been participating in MMO games since they began to gain popularity back in the 90's. Those of us that did game since that period were around when a subscription fee allowed players to access all content added to the game (without having to pay additional fees beyond the monthly sub).

For newer MMO gamers I can certainly understand how cash shops may seem like the norm now, but the fact is development studios used to be able to create games with similar levels of content (and smaller player bases) without turning to cash shops and DLC for additional funding. Early Everquest and even FFXI are good examples of this as far as MMOs go. Unfortunately for all of us, greed and pressure from management have changed this (and I speak from experience on this as someone from that industry).

Any developer will tell you that an MMO is "never done" and that new content will always be forthcoming. I can't recall any that have dared advertised the idea that your monthly subscription fee would only be used to keep the lights on, and to not expect any additional content in the game's future despite your continued financial support. That would be a ridiculous death sentence for any MMO project.

For better or worse, evolution happens, and there will likely come a day when no one bats an eye at cash shops or DLC. We're not there yet, nor likely to be there for some time, and until then threads like this are perfectly understandable (although obviously bound to be controversial as different generations of gamers clash).
I if you've been playing mmos as long as you imply you'd realize your own error. There are tons of 'dead' mmos where you pay literally to keep the lights on. Ffxi just announced that the end of this year will be the last content uodate. Ever. You can keep playing but the mmo is in fact 'done'. Ffxi subscriptions will keep the lights on and probably weed out the occasional discovered bug. There are TONS of dead mmos that still have servers but zero content still being mmade.

And to all the 'subscription should give me evetything' people, how do you justify buying expansions? It's a 1 time fee for content that according to your own logic, should he included via subscription.

You can't get all uppity about buying a Xmas hat in cash shop, then turn around and drop 40 bucks for an expac. If instead they put heavensward story in cash shop for 20, raids for 20, you'd be having a conniption. But if it's in a pretty box with a dvd, buying content is suddenly perfectly fine. Stop the double standards.
No, the error is in that I wasn't more clear in that I was referring to MMOs under development (either pre-release, or post when they're still being actively supported). Obviously my statement wouldn't apply to games where the developers have announced their intentions to discontinue future development (I felt that went without saying, but apparently not since I now have to clarify that for you). I hope we can both agree that, unlike FFXI's future, FFXIV is not at that point (and as such I feel your point doesn't apply to this game).

Expansions (which often double the size of the original game) versus microtransactions are an odd comparison. Again, I hope we can both agree that the former provides far more content per dollar than the latter. Having said that, I think we're all aware that expansions often come under fire as well, and are susceptible to the same problem that plagues cash shop items and DLC: developers insist the development of this content is not pulling resources from the core game, but (in my experience) that is rarely true.

You're applying a double standard by painting me with a brush of your making, one that doesn't mirror reality. I purchase expansions as well as DLC and items from cash shops, and never claimed not to. That doesn't mean I'm not aware of the issues surrounding them. It would also be ridiculously for me to claim I didn't miss the days when gamers received the same amount of content (as they do now) without being nickel and dimed in the process. I'm sure others feel the same, where as yet others are unfamiliar with these games every operating under a different model than they do now. Thus, threads like this (and the differing reactions to them) don't surprise me. The individuals who are surprised by these threads, however, are what surprises me (in that "how can this lack of understanding still exist" sort of way).