Highest DPS vs most fun

[OneWingedSora]

Uh... huh.

That's funny, given I have played with some of the best MNKs in this game, if not the best.

When I see MNKs doing 640 on T10-11, I will gladly say I am wrong.

[KikoriL]

Couldn't tell you. "His" group, not mine. Dunno when I implied Coil is the only thing we ever run; only that he's clocked at constant 600+, spikes upwards of 650+, and nary a NIN or DRG coming close when I personally witness it.

[Houston009]

So the 650+ DPS you mentioned previously was based on a spiked DPS mark, and not overall?

NIN and DRG not "coming close", when their spike damage is way higher than MNK's. You need to meet the good Ninjas and Dragoons lol.

Also, Coil is the only place where it matters to optimize your comp, anything outside of that isn't taken into consideration when most of it is "/faceroll".

Not trying to say MNK is bad or useless, just that it is no longer the "highest dps" in all relevant content.

[SpookyGhost]

words

MNK was never "needed" to complete content, but it made everyone's life easier.

You don't need BRD either, but would you prefer to not have one when you're still learning?

I'd personally rather have DK and Mantra over a slight DPS increase. There's a problem when your healer's have to "deal with" something when they could easily not be and save themselves unnecessary stress. Same with having songs over whatever you want to replace a BRD with. On farm content, I'll take the melee DPS that shows up because it literally doesn't matter at that point unless some class is required for the content (like PLD/BRD/SCH in T2 if we ever see something like that again).

It's also 2.55 and everything is on farm, so it literally doesn't matter who does what DPS as long as the boss dies. In 3.0 everything could easily be changed. This isn't really ever worth debating, even for min/max purposes.

[Craiger]

So the 650 DPS you mentioned previously was based on a spiked DPS mark, and not overall?

NIN and DRG not "coming close", when their "spike" damage is way higher than MNK's. You need to meet the good Ninjas and Dragoons lol.

Also, Coil is the only place where it matters to optimize your comp, anything outside of that isn't taken into consideration when most of it is "/faceroll".

Not trying to say MNK is bad or useless, just that it is no longer the "highest dps" in all relevant content.

That's just the thing, DRG and NIN have very high spike damage, and if you took the average of like 10+ runs, would NIN and DRG actually be on top of MNK? or is everyone just taking the highest parse they have every got?

Also, like I've said earlier, dummy parses that's shorter than 6 mins or something, doesn't really matter, because DPS could still be dropping/increasing after 4 mins or whatever. Most fights are longer than that anyways(unless you're overgeared and in Lucrezia maybe)

On the topic of Lucrezia... They are incredible players, but why is their MNK parsing so "low"? I don't have BiS, and I'm not the best on MNK yet, but I thought someone of that caliber would get at least 600 DPS in T10, and not like 580. Their NIN isn't getting the crazy 650 DPS people say they get. They're doing the AoE strat, and I'm not sure how much/if they use any AoE on NIN and MNK, but their DPS should at least not be lower than a normal run.

I still aren't convinced MNK is behind DRG, maybe behind NIN, but either way, I really hope MNK is buffed in 3.0...

It doesn't really matter who is highest DPS, because unless MNK is way above NIN, NIN wins on overall DPS... Trick Attack gives you like 1,6%(?) extra total DPS for your raid, which might not sound like much, but with the DPS people do right now, that's easily 40+ DPS that you can add on top of NINs normal DPS.

I can't really make a statement about DRG and their BRD buff, because I'm not sure on the % damage increase (actual increase) BRD gets... and who knows if BRD always will be in the party in 3.0.

Dragon Kick is nice and all, but Trick Attack can give NINs like 6%+ DPS, and that's not counting the groups that can get really high overall DPS. Trick Attack isn't just that easy to calculate extra DPS, I know... but MNKs need to at least have 3% higher ST DPS than NIN in 3.0, to make it balanced IMO

[Ephier]

MNK was never "needed" to complete content, but it made everyone's life easier.

You don't need BRD either, but would you prefer to not have one when you're still learning?

I'd personally rather have DK and Mantra over a slight DPS increase. There's a problem when your healer's have to "deal with" something when they could easily not be and save themselves unnecessary stress. Same with having songs over whatever you want to replace a BRD with. On farm content, I'll take the melee DPS that shows up because it literally doesn't matter at that point unless some class is required for the content (like PLD/BRD/SCH in T2 if we ever see something like that again).

It's also 2.55 and everything is on farm, so it literally doesn't matter who does what DPS as long as the boss dies. In 3.0 everything could easily be changed. This isn't really ever worth debating, even for min/max purposes.

It can go both ways. While it may be easier healing on the AoE magic damage such as that from gigaflare, having NIN and DRG for adds shortens the time adds are alive, lowering the amount of time split heals are needed. MNK has 0 burst, while NIN and DRG have tons of it on top of their sustain. I agree with you that having DK and 20% mantra is nice, personally our group runs 4 mantras, NIN, DRG, BRD, and WAR just to help what ever way we can.

What I won't agree with is the BRD, at least for progression purposes. The longer the fight goes, the more the need for TP is increased, at the beginning of progression most groups saw enrages or soft enrages and that is with their melee and BRD TP sustained by paeon. With no paeon, melee would be doing almost nothing towards the end of the fight while they wait for invigorate to come back. They would also have to cut expensive dots out such as mutilate, phlebotimize and touch of death, in order to hold on to TP as long as possible, which would result in a further DPS loss.

[Chiffre]

Lower than every other DPS, but most looked for.

My main class is BRD and well if you know how to Play BRD you are not the end of the dps chart. I don't like it that everyone declines BRD as a supporting class.
A good equipped and well played BRD is also a good DPS!

[OneWingedSora]

My main class is BRD and well if you know how to Play BRD you are not the end of the dps chart. I don't like it that everyone declines BRD as a supporting class.
A good equipped and well played BRD is also a good DPS!

No matter how good of a bard you are, if the other DPS are at the same level, you will be the lowest(Unless there is a SMN in the party).

[Spoekes]

My main class is BRD and well if you know how to Play BRD you are not the end of the dps chart. I don't like it that everyone declines BRD as a supporting class.
A good equipped and well played BRD is also a good DPS!

You don't need to take a personal insult in it, a good BRD is relative close to the other DPS, but there is gap.
I challenge you to google for "FCOB parse" and browse though the results.
Of course you may be able to nitpick some fights that favor BRD for its uptime, mutlidotting or whatever, but at the end of the day it is intend for BRD to do slighty less than other DPS.

No matter how good of a bard you are, if the other DPS are at the same level, you will be the lowest(Unless there is a SMN in the party).

unless it was a joke: yay for fighting myths with myths!

[OneWingedSora]

unless it was a joke: yay for fighting myths with myths!

Clearly you haven't seen what good bards can do.



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