Low probabilities of Triple Triad drops, big fish, etc. Grinds becoming unreal.

[Odett]

Optional yes but put in for all to have "fun" with, but there is a point when the "fun" wears off and it turns into grind and people get tired of the content that may have brought them to the game.

Maybe learn to pace yourself and it won't be exhausting. TC mentioned they spent seven hours trying to get Bahamut. Take a break. Try a few matches more later. Pace yourself. This is an MMO, things can and will take time. Triple Triad hasn't even been out for a week and people are whining they can't get all the cards.

Like other people have stated, these are all optional items. This game has many things that are a grind, like the relic quest (but nowhere near close to other MMOs), as well as a HUGE number of things that are handed to you. Stop seeing gear or cards or any other reward that you MIGHT get as the determining factor for how much progress you've made during your play session. Do x content because you want to, if the item you desire drops, that's great, if not, do it again now, or maybe tomorrow, or the next day. You'll get there when you get there.

Stop thinking you'll get everything handed to you. Take things at a comfortable pace and you won't burn yourself out by trying to get a card, relic, mount, or whatever at a speed that is unhealthy for you. Enjoy the journey more than the destination and you'll have a lot more fun.

Someone mentioned 2.0 earlier and said how great it was. Are the rose-tinted goggles already being distributed? Are we talking about the same 2.0? The one where people repeated TWO dungeons every week to cap tomes and a lot of people wouldn't even touch Coil because the rewards weren't worth the effort to them, and the ones that did only logged in on Monday nights to clear their turns and log off for the rest of the week because there was absolutely NOTHING else to do? The 2.0 where there was absolutely no open world content and the best armor was obtained by repeating WP again and again?

[Yukiko]

(..) Me thinks the people who are against this sort of thing (better drop rates) already achieved (suffered) this and want others to suffer equally.

Then there are the people that got their drop 1st try and are like "What are you complaining about? Everything is fine. It was easy!" Or the people that are like "Final Coil for Lyfe!" and think they have valid insights to offer into things like Fishing and other content they don't care about at all.

Basically the entire attitude can be summed up to: "It doesn't affect me so therefore I'm fine with it." And I think that's a real shame especially because you're bound to be on the bad side of RNG one day asking yourself "Why do I play this game?" (..)

Can confirm this, talked with some friends and the further they were with the achivement their attitude changed towards those who are not as fast...
I guess the "you have to suffer the same, or my effort was in vain" is best summ up...

Edit: That makes me wonder why they are doing achivements, just to show others how good they are? Dont they make it for themselves?

[BreathlessTao]

I don't mind a grind that is long IF the reward lasts. Since the games progression is as Vertical as can be and things get outdated so fast, the grind is NO WHERE NEAR APPROPRIATE.
Especially not having in mind "the game has to appeal to casuals, we have beginners and new players in mind when designing content etc..."

This. Gear lasts for like, what, 2-3 months at best? But if you're not playing 24/7 (or don't have the luck of having all sorts of friends to help you with everything), you won't even be anywhere near getting certain things. And that especially goes against the "having the casuals in mind" mindset indeed, those who can't play 24/7. Only so long until the feeling of not making any progress whatsoever makes them stop paying their subs...

Also, the comment about fishing being optional, Coil and Extremes are optional, it's ALL optional. Playing this game is optional!

[...]

When I work I get paid. Where's the pay (reward) here? And I certainly don't pay someone else to give me the "privilege" of working.

This too. Basically the whole game is optional, to my knowledge at least, nobody's being held at gunpoint to play it. But that's just the point - playing. It means getting out of the daily grind, to have fun and relax. The RNG and all the grinds (huge overlap there) put in the game lately - they syphon away the fun part. They make it a chore, a job, and by the time it gets done, you don't even feel the "payment", because whatever you achieved is already obsolete. And we are paying for it, with our money and our time. Our time that we want to use to unwind. (Yes, the devs spend their time on it too - however, not their free time, as it is their job, and as it is their job, they are geting paid for it.) And of course it can be shrugged off with an "it's just optional anyway". But if you don't do it, for whatever reason, sooner or later you'll stumble into people telling you what a noob you are for not having completed a specific thing.

Hard content that one has to practice to beat? That's one thing. Working your way up, up, up, training until you're good enough - that's a challenge. Throwing yourself at RNG day and night, in the form of menial tasks that don't even require any effort, without gaining anything (and especially even paying for it, whether we consider the subscription fee or the in-game currencies) from it at all - that's not challenge. And if you enjoy that, you're not a "hard worker", you just have a gambling addiction, which is an actual mental issue.

[Lemuria]

Yeah, there's an awful lot of grinds lately. The zodiac grind is one I'm particularly dissatisfied with as there's no real 'casual' approach to it unless you're willing to wait a year. For example, if I just did my usual daily routine to get my Nexus light it would take 167 days, almost 6 months to complete, and thats WITH the light bonuses we now have.

I've been kind of lucky with card drops so far, but I can easily sympathise with those who are struggling. I had a horrible time with Atma drops when they were first released, so I know all too well what it's like to be on the receiving end of bad RNG.

[Jinko]

If you just compared a dice roll to hard work, you can stay out of my work place.

Well said, it seems people get easily confused that random chance equates to hard work around here, its clever that SE can condition their masses into thinking that none the less.

[Alberel]

SE should just implement smart RNG and be done with it. Pure RNG has never worked properly in MMOs as 'rare' items will always drop on the first try for one player and NEVER after 100 tries for another.

Blizzard saw sense when they modified the RNG algorithms to increase chances after every failed roll and it works incredibly well. You can get super lucky occasionally, but never so incredibly unlucky you just give up playing, and that's something SquareEnix needs to be aware of because I know people that up and quit the game over the atma grind simply because they had bad luck and never saw a drop after weeks of farming.

RNG can be fun in that it adds some unpredictability and tension to progression but it also gets out of hand when one player has an unfairly difficult time completing something just because they always get bad rolls. Smart RNG keeps the former and removes the latter. Problem solved.

[Purrfectstorm]

SE should just implement smart RNG and be done with it. Pure RNG has never worked properly in MMOs as 'rare' items will always drop on the first try for one player and NEVER after 100 tries for another.

Blizzard saw sense when they modified the RNG algorithms to increase chances after every failed roll and it works incredibly well. You can get super lucky occasionally, but never so incredibly unlucky you just give up playing, and that's something SquareEnix needs to be aware of because I know people that up and quit the game over the atma grind simply because they had bad luck and never saw a drop after weeks of farming.

RNG can be fun in that it adds some unpredictability and tension to progression but it also gets out of hand when one player has an unfairly difficult time completing something just because they always get bad rolls. Smart RNG keeps the former and removes the latter. Problem solved.

I remember this from Diablo. I think this is a really great idea. Some people don't seem to understand how extremely bad luck can start to kill enjoyment of the game. I don't want things handed to me but I don't want to grind so terribly long for every little thing. What's wrong with a middle ground?

[Dgsoil]

The Cactpot was a bust

This is pure and utter greed. You think it's unfair you didn't win the lottery? Something that is/was/will always be 100% luck based?

Ignoring that nonsense for a moment - Personally, I enjoy them adding more grind to the game. Why is your point of view on the game more valid than my own? I like my gameplay to include some play in my game. And as for the Triple Triad card drop rates being "too grindy" as well, it hasn't even been out a week and you are complaining, your whole post reeks of I want it now. Learn some patience.

Should drop rates be increased a bit? Perhaps. But don't pretend you want anything more than stuff given to you with that attitude.

[Adire]

In The Secret World, we had gear that dropped from end game dungeons that was good. It was sort of a holdover until you had enough Black Bullions which dropped in set amounts after dungeon completion and were used to purchase and slowly upgrade the gear with a higher stat cap than the dungeon dropped gear.

In short, dungeon gear was the best at first and RNG obtained. Bullion gear was the best after being upgraded and was gotten with consistency by doing the same dungeons. People could gear up with rng gear when it dropped and meanwhile upgrade to the better gear as they got bullions.

I think a system like that would be great. RNG helps but doesn't cripple you if you have bad luck, work and bullions get you better gear to replace the RNG gear, and they're both obtained from the same source, so you can get and use RNG gear while you grind for the better gear and use it and mix and match them along the way.

[Kiara1]

blip)

This is extremely lucky! It took me around 100 wins to get my first card drop from an npc, and then probably 50+ more to get another card.
The drop rate from npc is really stupid, thats why I never really got interested in triple triad, I dont think its worth it spending 3 hours for one card that im not gonna use anyway

Dungeon drops seem more decent though, I got mog king from 3 hm runs, shiva from 3 ex runs, tonberry from one wp run. It's weird that its easier to get cards from dungeons than beating npcs