Quote Originally Posted by Snugglebutt View Post
To me and my perceptions, there is a different ideology at work on such issues. One is beneficial to the cohesiveness and enjoyment of the game for the majority while the other is detrimental and damaging to that cohesiveness. For example casuals are generally arguing for inclusiveness and enjoyment enhanced for the majority while in my opinion and my perception is that many of the hardcore raiders are arguing and promoting exclusiveness, the enjoyment enhanced for only the minority.

To me personally and my perceptions, many of the hardcore raiders are really only concerned with themselves and maybe they feel like they are on the defensive in the trenches fighting off the majority aka casuals in this case who are trying to get them to think about and enhance the game for all and not just themselves (themselves being the hardcore raiders).
You break this down into only two but I offer you a third view point. From nothing more than a game balance perspective where everything has some effort value for some reward. When the effort to reward ratio breaks down the game falls out of balance. Everything top tier has a price associated. With raid you have to find a group, practice for hours on end, and play the RNG game week after week, but the reward is the top tier gear with no worries about upgrading. With poe gear you must first farm for a week or 2 and then hunt for hours to get the 3000 points to upgrade it. In both of these situations a price is paid. So while some people act like hunts is unlimited the fact remains a time price was paid. When a suggestion ignores balancing the price to reward ratio it's not good.

Not everyone argues from a place of haves or have nots. Some people are game theorists who just want whats best for the game overall. I have no ego for the gear I have and I always want more players moving through the ranks to the tougher fights. Without new players the raiding pool dies out. Our two sides naturally live together and coexist. The solutions in this game shouldn't ever cater to one group. That said I will always argue against the extremes of either the "casual" or "raid" group because they vehemently ignore the other side for their own self interests. That's a lot of what we are seeing in this exact thread. The real answers are in the middle. Between both groups opinions. Where the time and effort cost is fair to the reward received.

The world isn't black and white. There are more than two view points.