Time to address long queue times for low level players

[LineageRazor]

Is there just no joy in that for anyone anymore?

Everyone has things they want to accomplish in this game, and only a certain number of hours per day available to accomplish those things. If queueing up specifically to help newbies brings you joy, that is wonderful, and more power to you. Not everyone is a born mentor, though; for many, possibly most people tutoring newbies is a chore, and not fun at all. If they're not going to be rewarded for doing it, they won't bother.

SE has good, solid experience with this phenominon from FFXI. While there were good, helpful people in that game, as there are in this one, there's just not enough to meet the need. For the longest time, FFXI had NO rewards for completing certain instances once you had already completed them, and newer folks trying to put together a party to do them had a horrendous time of it. They might be able to cobble together two or three sympethetic souls after a few hours, but most such instances needed a full party of six for a good chance of successs. This game's reward system has worked MIRACLES, compared to the situation in FFXI. People gripe about 30-40 minute queue times, but I have very literally spent entire days trying and failing to put together a party in FFXI for an unrewarding instance.

Don't mistake this mercenary attitude as meaning people are bad, or don't care. Even folks who wouldn't be signing up for low-level instances without the promise of reward are usually friendly and helpful toward the newbies. There are bad apples in the batch as well, but it's not only mean-spirited to harrass newbies, but also badly impacts the efficiency of the run. They want to get the run DONE, and abusing the other players is not going to help in that goal. Harrassment happens, but it's much less frequent than a lot of forum posts would have you believe.

Is that what constitutes as speed running? I thought it's tanks pulling multi packs regardless of what the healer had in mind? There are dungeons that have mobs that are out of the regular path way. If I pull mobs pack by pack but not pull mobs that are optional it's considered speed running?

It is one part of speed running, and the part that is most often seen in lower level dungeons. For the most part, lack of aoe abilities and lack of overpowered high-level gear makes multi-pack pulling in low level instances unproductive. I was trying to address the problem as it exists for low level players. I'll bet a lot of people even in this forum went a long time before they ever saw both paths in the Thousand Maws, and many have probably NEVER explored the optional branch by the second Magitek Gate. Most likely, many have never read the messages posted on the dungeon walls there, either, even though they present some cool flavor text for the dungeon.

[Kosmos992k]

Everyone has things they want to accomplish in this game, and only a certain number of hours per day available to accomplish those things. *snip*

SE has good, solid experience with this phenominon from FFXI. While there were good, helpful people in that game, as there are in this one, there's just not enough to meet the need. *snip*This game's reward system has worked MIRACLES, compared to the situation in FFXI. People gripe about 30-40 minute queue times, but I have very literally spent entire days trying and failing to put together a party in FFXI for an unrewarding instance.

Don't mistake this mercenary attitude as meaning people are bad, or don't care. Even folks who wouldn't be signing up for low-level instances without the promise of reward are usually friendly and helpful toward the newbies. There are bad apples in the batch as well, but it's not only mean-spirited to harrass newbies, but also badly impacts the efficiency of the run.

Indeed, I understand how much worse it could be and that it's better because of the rewards, those rewards bring clear benefits. It's not so much the mercenary attitude, and of course wishing to be rewarded doesn't make anyone bad or good. I definitely agree about the bad apples, and forcing things in the low level dungeons is very counter productive as you say. I guess I just wish more people could apply a more utopian mindset where things like helping for the heck of it actually bring a sense of reward that is equal to that felt with a material gain. But, as you say, everyone has things that they want to accomplish and as Ashkendor said earlier, everyone has their reasons for playing as they do.

It is one part of speed running, and the part that is most often seen in lower level dungeons. For the most part, lack of aoe abilities and lack of overpowered high-level gear makes multi-pack pulling in low level instances unproductive. I was trying to address the problem as it exists for low level players. I'll bet a lot of people even in this forum went a long time before they ever saw both paths in the Thousand Maws, and many have probably NEVER explored the optional branch by the second Magitek Gate. Most likely, many have never read the messages posted on the dungeon walls there, either, even though they present some cool flavor text for the dungeon.

LOL! yes, indeed, I've explored the branches in dungeons including The Thousand Maws, I read the notices on the wall, I even read the quest text...They do add flavor, as so much of the game does - if people slow down enough to take a look, or smell the roses. Personally I find that the game has so much of this kind of thing that playing at a slower pace and enjoying everything as you go - including the NPC chatter and various 'flavor text' in the game, makes the game that much more enjoyable for me. Though I know not everyone will feel that way. it just seems a pity sometimes how quickly people do things and gloss over the finer details, when those details are part of what really makes the game what it is.

[Eye_Gore]

Most likely, many have never read the messages posted on the dungeon walls there

I stopped once to read the first one. When I was done I had to sprint to get back up to the group, and I'm the tank.