SMN redesign in expansion?

[atomicdeath]

I main summoner since its release and grinded out an apocalypse. I have gotten used to the way it plays. That said, I would trade it in a second for something that feels like a summoner.

[Spellbinder]

You do understand that Summoner needs to be in melee range as much as possible to get maximum DPS, right?

And I'm almost offended by the fact that a mage has to stand in melee range, hoping those sparse few swings of their book between spell casts can help them keep up with the rest of their party.

[Connor]

I love that people still think any of the jobs will be redesigned at all at expansion. A few minor potency changes, maybe. That's it.

[dday3six]

And I'm almost offended by the fact that a mage has to stand in melee range, hoping those sparse few swings of their book between spell casts can help them keep up with the rest of their party.

It's not just auto-attacks that cause this. Not having to run in for Miasma II, is also a plus. However, yes aside from MP issue, SMN does need to have damage output looked at as well.

[Akiza]

The problem is Summoner was lazily designed. SE didn't do enough to differentiate Summoner from Arcanist like they did with Scholar. Summoner ends up being an Arcanist with Fester while Scholar ends up being a Discipline Priests. It looks like all SE had to do was have the Scholar branch off of Arcanist and have the Arcanist become a job by rolling all Summoner spells into it. To differentiate between two DPS developers have to give them either different spells or different play styles and Arcanist and Summoner have the same spells and play style so they are essentially the same.

[Zedd702]

...and if that's exactly your point you've lost all credibility as well.

I like how you say I lost ALL credibility on the basis of one thing like Summon III...

I'm speaking about the job in its entirety. I'm well aware that Ifrit is the best DPS egi for summoner. But at the same time his downtime (ie travel once a mob has been defeated and he goes halfway or more back to the summoner before attacking the next target is also a factor in loss of DPS, whereas it takes Garuda mere moments to start pew pew at her next target... Everything else in that specific post that I quoted and that you wholeheartedly shotdown, due to Summon III, has solid merit.

The problem is Summoner was lazily designed. SE didn't do enough to differentiate Summoner from Arcanist like they did with Scholar. Summoner ends up being an Arcanist with Fester while Scholar ends up being a Discipline Priests. It looks like all SE had to do was have the Scholar branch off of Arcanist and have the Arcanist become a job by rolling all Summoner spells into it. To differentiate between two DPS developers have to give them either different spells or different play styles and Arcanist and Summoner have the same spells and play style so they are essentially the same.

Deja Vu?

This also is exactly what I am talking about as well, but before I am hopped on by Alistaire once more, because I left out something as moot as Ifrit when talking about summoner as a whole, Summoner is Arcanist with: Fester, Summon III, Tri-disater (spell name speaks for itself), and Enkindle. I don't even like to mention Spur as it is essentially Rouse, but for DPS...

I said it before and I will say it again as I agree with Akiza as well. SMN is the most lazily designed Job in the game and needs to be diversified from its core class like Scholar is...

End. Of. My. Story.

I missed this:

I love that people still think any of the jobs will be redesigned at all at expansion. A few minor potency changes, maybe. That's it.

I love how you think that the jobs will remain the same, when level cap increases are coming with the expansion, which implies new skills, which means balancing must be looked at when considering new skills. I'd say that's a little more than mere potency changes... wouldn't you?

[Zedd702]

Oh!

Yoshi hath spoken on this issue!

Q: I'm sure the job balance will be greatly adjusted when Heavensward is released, but do you have any jobs that you plan to adjust during the patch 2.5 series?

Y: In particular, I think we need to consider Summoner, but we're still working on the adjustments. Originally, we were planning to add new actions to Summoner with Heavensward to adjust MP consumption. However, since 3.0 is still a ways off, we're thinking about other careful adjustments. As we release each piece of content we see which jobs are too strong or not strong enough. We're also focusing on carefully adjusting things for 3.0, so we'd like to make adjustments as soon as possible, but please wait for a bit longer.

Source: http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/124...=1#post6333229

Please be good, please be good! *crosses fingers that it's both good and before the expansion*

[Dyne_Fellpool]

I doubt SMN will see major changes. Hopefully the 51-60 spells will address most of their deficiencies.

If they DID redesign anything this is how I'd do it.

[Dwill]

And I'm almost offended by the fact that a mage has to stand in melee range, hoping those sparse few swings of their book between spell casts can help them keep up with the rest of their party.

Exactly, having to do it doesn't mean we have to enjoy it. Having to be in melee to do our maximum output is flat out stupid.

[Zedd702]

To be honest they should've allowed SMN to have an auto-attack similar to ruin (x projectile fired from book)...

We can summon monstrosities, that breath fire, fly/float, made of earth and conjure poisons (stupid IMO), but we have to hit stuff with our spellbooks? -_^

You don't see Merlin whackin people with his Grimoire in the stories.