Allowing Tells in Duties.

[Callinon]

The original reason given for preventing tells within a duty was because they were concerned people would be abusive toward newer players.

Unfortunately it also prevents you from helping newer players without doing it publicly.

For instance, if I'm in a dungeon with a new tank that doesn't quite know what he's doing and I want to help him out...
- You know if you Shield Lob one of the targets, you'll have better threat than just walking up to them
- You might want to Flash a couple times to pick up everything, the healer's getting punched a little more than is necessary

That sort of thing. I have to do that in party chat, which can be embarrassing for a new tank. Embarrassment can lead to a defensive response rather than lead to him learning to do a better job. People don't like being called out in public, and people generally don't like having their lack of experience pointed out. It's MUCH better if that can be done privately, just between me and him.

[Nyalia]

Unfortunately it also prevents you from helping newer players without doing it publicly.

Except tells are just as likely, if not more likely, to be used to insult the new tank until they leave. If you have to do it publicly, you're more likely to be kicked for being a jerk.

[Callinon]

Except tells are just as likely, if not more likely, to be used to insult the new tank until they leave. If you have to do it publicly, you're more likely to be kicked for being a jerk.

No way to know for certain, but I'd bet that for every person who feels the need to harass someone until they leave a duty, there are probably 2 or 3 people out there who just want to help them do better without having to do so publicly and look like a jerk for helping.

[mosaicex]

I'm pretty sure it has to do with the fact that you're not in your server when you're in duties/pvp.

Then why can we still use FC chat?

[Nyalia]

No way to know for certain, but I'd bet that for every person who feels the need to harass someone until they leave a duty, there are probably 2 or 3 people out there who just want to help them do better without having to do so publicly and look like a jerk for helping.

Yeah, but you have to also factor in the people who "offer help" in a condescending and insulting manner and are no better than the people who just insult outright. There are only four people in a duty - I don't see what advantage there is in sending tells vs just using party chat unless it is to exclude someone from the conversation.

Also, I can see an issue with /tells since you aren't on your server - names are only unique on a given server. Getting/sending channel chat back to your server isn't a big deal because that can be uniquely identified, but what happens when you are in a duty with a "Naruto Uzumaki" from another server, and you try to send him a tell, but there's also a "Naruto Uzumaki" on your server (like there is on every server)? If you want tells NOT to be sendable to people in the duty with you, but instead be sendable to only people on your server, that'd be less ambiguous, though it could be weird when you want to send a tell to someone who is on your server but who is currently in a duty (possibly with you).

[Niwashi]

No way to know for certain, but I'd bet that for every person who feels the need to harass someone until they leave a duty, there are probably 2 or 3 people out there who just want to help them do better without having to do so publicly and look like a jerk for helping.

If saying something would make you look like a jerk, that's a pretty good indication that saying it falls into the harassing category rather than the helpful category. Saying things that are genuinely helpful will just make you (and generally the person you're helping as well) look good to everyone involved. Just make sure that your "help" doesn't insult anyone.

[Viridiana]

If saying something would make you look like a jerk, that's a pretty good indication that saying it falls into the harassing category rather than the helpful category. Saying things that are genuinely helpful will just make you (and generally the person you're helping as well) look good to everyone involved. Just make sure that your "help" doesn't insult anyone.

Right. And that's why so many people I try to help just drop group without responding, even when the remaining party is like "wth? Why would he drop just from that?"

Oh wait. >_>

[Callinon]

If saying something would make you look like a jerk, that's a pretty good indication that saying it falls into the harassing category rather than the helpful category. Saying things that are genuinely helpful will just make you (and generally the person you're helping as well) look good to everyone involved. Just make sure that your "help" doesn't insult anyone.

People have a tendency to react defensively if you point out that they're doing something wrong publicly. You can do it by offering genuine help and still get that reaction because it was offered publicly and is embarrassing for them.

[Jas710]

Not being able to send tells is the least of problems I have with the whole backwards-assed negative-reinforced grouping system, which could fill an entirely new forum thread. But yes I agree, let's allow players to comm through tells. All the hypothetical bs on the why's/why not's don't hold up. Go check out other MMO's and you'll instantly realize how far behind FFXIV is in this regard.

[Wintersandman]

Go check out other MMO's and you'll instantly realize how far behind FFXIV is in this regard.

Oop sorry was responding to a message sorry we wiped.

I mean to say not having tells in dungeons or FC/LS chat in PvP I think is a good thing. You're on other people's time, be respectful.

Maybe FFXIV is ahead. Since they view this as the mentality.