It's very depressing how...

[Duelle]

most people playing this game act like soulless thralls lol. SE puts oils and sands back into rewards for hunting...literally 90% of the server starts teleporting from one place to another doing trash content to quickly attain their i130. And then people complain about SE putting hunts back...I just cannot...

Have people playing this game ever considered playing content that they find fun regardless of the rewards behind it? (I have a hard time believing people actually enjoy hunts sorry, might be wrong here though).

Sorry, but not being able to keep up gearwise means DPS in groups that are in final coil gear or with upgraded relics pull mobs off me without trying (ran into one such BLM when I did keeper of the lake).

On that note, I see the devs haven't learned from what happened the first time. Instead of doing the right thing (put upgrade mats up for Soldiery tomes) they went back to putting stuff in hunts. Which kill dungeons and funnel people to specific zones. I sure love seeing history repeat itself. /sarcasm

[Tiggy]

Enough to make sure there's no chance of getting derailed because someone else keeps tripping on the team jump rope mechanics. What good is doing end game content if people just rage quit and flail around, and I can't do anything about it, no matter how much I try to learn fight mechanics? It's all luck based; I only cleared Twintania because I had the fortune of a group offering to carry people for Soldiery bonuses. Every other attempt failed in ways that I was powerless to prevent.

That's a straw man. A bad party doesn't change anything about how effective the gear is. In a group of good players the gear difference is obvious. The math of the game that determines damage, healing, etc doesn't care about you're party makeup. Throwing a bad group at it is a horrible reason to ignore what a good group can do with it instead. A bad group is a different problem and a different discussion entirely. You're also seemingly assuming everyone has trouble winning so that what you said is relevant, but that isn't a universal problem.

[Zohar_Lahar]

It is so not lucky based. The coil fights are tightly scripted with limited RNG windows for the boss mechanics. You don't clear them without putting in the time an effort to recruit, organize, and coordinate, and practice. You got lucky because someone else put in all that effort outside of T5 and just need someone to provide soldiery bonus. This challenge only get harder with more current content, and probably harder than the boss itself, especially with the attitude of people not wanting newer players, being all exclusive and all.

So you don't think there's something seriously wrong with the implementation of vertical progression, if T5 can still shut players down even with the most recent gear? We have item levels more than twice our (stagnant) max level. None of this makes any sense.

[Izsha]

My group can go in and beat t5 10 out of 10 times. By virtue of our gear and skill we can beat it every time. That's not luck at all. Raids success is based on the groups gear and skill. Duty finder randomly throws together players of different, wait for it, skill and gear. Duty finder is the random element in raiding, not the raid. YOU bring the rng to a raid with duty finder. That's your fault. If you grab bag random players you will have a random set of results. Consistent set of players, consistent (and slowly inproving) results.

And no it isn't a problem you can double the ilvl and die. Just because you ate a mushroom in Mario didn't mean you could fall off a cliff, but you could take litterally double the hits. If you can't jump properly no amount of stars and mushrooms will get you past Lv 1.1. Gear doesn't completely nullify EVERY mechanic and that's fine.

[NyarukoW]

So you don't think there's something seriously wrong with the implementation of vertical progression, if T5 can still shut players down even with the most recent gear?...

There is nothing "seriously wrong" with T5 being able to shut down players who do not learn the mechanics geared or otherwise. Is it the fault of the golf course where at hole 1 the average guy with the newest most advanced set of clubs always whiffs at the tee? Now multiply that by 4 say the group is doing best ball for team play, like a company team building exercise, it is just a random group of new players. One shanks left into the drink, the other hooks right into the bunker, and the last guys sends ball backwards. Nope don't expect the group to make par. Gearing does not equal skill or knowledge.

[Zohar_Lahar]

And no it isn't a problem you can double the ilvl and die. Just because you ate a mushroom in Mario didn't mean you could fall off a cliff, but you could take litterally double the hits. If you can't jump properly no amount of stars and mushrooms will get you past Lv 1.1. Gear doesn't completely nullify EVERY mechanic and that's fine.

So then I ask again: why does Augmented Ironworks matter so much if cheap boss mechanics can instant kill you because someone couldn't memorize the dance? Why all this drama over hunts, when i130 gear won't save you from Twisters, Heavensfall, or Landslide, much less turn you Super Saiyan and dominate Nael in a duel? Too much effort....too little gain.

They should have raised the level cap with 2.4, at least then we'd have new abilities and traits....not this stagnancy.

[Izsha]

So then I ask again: why does Augmented Ironworks matter so much if cheap boss mechanics can instant kill you because someone couldn't memorize the dance? Why all this drama over hunts, when i130 gear won't save you from Twisters, Heavensfall, or Landslide, much less turn you Super Saiyan and dominate Nael in a duel? Too much effort....too little gain.

They should have raised the level cap with 2.4, at least then we'd have new abilities and traits....not this stagnancy.

I was doing T12 yesterday with my static. We hit the 14th rebirth explosion. 3 people died, 3 barely lived, and the tanks lived of course. A few more ilvls and they would have all lived. We also probably wouldn't have hit the 14th because we would have higher dps with more ilvl. If we had enough I level we would get to that phase with 4 bennu instead of 5. We also wiped at 1% the same night with less than 6000 hp left on the monster. If my whole group had more ilvl we would have got our 1st T12 kill last night.

I send you back to my Mario example. "If mushrooms and stars don't save you from falling off a cliff, why the mad dash to obtain mushrooms and stars!? Huh!?".

Because it helps with EVERYTHING that isn't a cliff (1 shot mechanic). Where was the last thread about wiping to conflags? There were a lot before ilvl made that dps check a non issue. When was the last thread bitching about dps fail at titans heart? There used to be. Death sentence? Used to be. T4 in its entirety? Used to be. Failing enrage method in t2? Used to be. Feeding slime in t1? Used to be. Remember not killing suparna and chirida in Garuda hm before they wipe the raid? Ilvl fixed that too.

Just because you have infinite mushrooms doesn't mean mean you can ignore cliffs. You have ONE job in t5 that gear and echo don't fix. It used to be every. Single. Solitary. Mechanic. You used to need virus, storms path, adlo, inner beast, halone, topped off, and a secondary cooldown just to survive one death sentence. It was a team coordinated effort to survive just 1 tank killer. You don't deal with that now. Ilvl is massive. But you still have to find your damn jump button when you get to a cliff. Deal with it.

[Dement]

So then I ask again: why does Augmented Ironworks matter so much if cheap boss mechanics can instant kill you because someone couldn't memorize the dance? Why all this drama over hunts, when i130 gear won't save you from Twisters, Heavensfall, or Landslide, much less turn you Super Saiyan and dominate Nael in a duel? Too much effort....too little gain.

Taking Twintania as an example, while gear won't nullify Twisters there are a lot of other moves that it does help with. Death Sentence used to one shot tanks unless precise cool downs were used and shields were in place. Now that gear outstrips the fight, a mistake isn't going to lead to the death of the tank from this move. Conflags used to be a very tight DPS check which has been eased by virtue of higher gear. All fights have a level of healing check that must be met, a certain amount of damage is going to go out and the healers need to cover this while preserving their MP which once again is eased by gear.

Since you want to use Twisters as your example in this, higher gear can ease that as well. Let's say that 5 people are able to dodge twisters with any sort of consistency, at one point completing the fight with only 5 members was unheard of but as you get higher and higher gear it becomes very much doable with only 5 members alive. Furthermore, the higher DPS you have as a result of gear can shorten the Twister phase considerably thus giving not only your 5 members who are consistent better odds of completing the phase but also the 3 members who are may be inconsistent with the dodge mechanic. If they only have to dodge 3 instead of 6, you have a higher chance of progressing.

[VoltaAsura]

most people playing this game act like soulless thralls lol. SE puts oils and sands back into rewards for hunting...literally 90% of the server starts teleporting from one place to another doing trash content to quickly attain their i130. And then people complain about SE putting hunts back...I just cannot...

Have people playing this game ever considered playing content that they find fun regardless of the rewards behind it? (I have a hard time believing people actually enjoy hunts sorry, might be wrong here though).

The issue is how SE added these items into the game again. They should have learned the first time. To make it worse, you need even more points to get the upgrade items this time around. Don't blame the player when you should be blaming the game.

Also, if gear didn't go obsolete as fast as it does, I don't think people would care about hunts as much as they do. That's my 2 gil.

[LunaHoshino]

So then I ask again: why does Augmented Ironworks matter so much if cheap boss mechanics can instant kill you because someone couldn't memorize the dance? Why all this drama over hunts, when i130 gear won't save you from Twisters, Heavensfall, or Landslide, much less turn you Super Saiyan and dominate Nael in a duel? Too much effort....too little gain.

Me having solid Ironworks gear was what saved my Odin group from a wipe last night. The tank went down and I was second on the aggro table (due in no small part to my gear), so I was able to grab Odin and tank him long enough for the healers to get the tank back up and top him off so he could take Odin back. I ate a Sanngetall to the face and survived it because I had enough HP to be able to do so-- again, thanks to my gear. Had I not been able to grab him and tank him, he would've gone straight for the healers and we would've wiped then and there.

Also, if your party doesn't have good gear, you can forget about getting through Odin's DPS check. It doesn't matter that you're doing your rotation perfectly if you're not putting out enough damage to beat his enrage timer.