We have finally come full circle, SMN's need help!

[Sunako]

well, let's hope the new CT dungeon will have SMN oriented gear, i120 full Det+Crit over SS anytime. If so then this would help SMN a little..

The problem with 120 parts is that you will lose vitality. In turn 13 it is good 2 have all possible vitality if you want 6100 - 6300 hp and if you dumb your gear with tank ring, that is even bigger dps loss than using ilvl 130 spell speed chest/belt instead 120 det/crit ones.

[Minorinz]

The problem with 120 parts is that you will lose vitality. In turn 13 it is good 2 have all possible vitality if you want 6100 - 6300 hp and if you dumb your gear with tank ring, that is even bigger dps loss than using ilvl 130 spell speed chest/belt instead 120 det/crit ones.

it's not a solution and yes vit is important but it shouldn't be fatal unless terribad healers in your party. The i120 gear doesn't really have that much vit drop either.

[Viridiana]

The problem with 120 parts is that you will lose vitality. In turn 13 it is good 2 have all possible vitality if you want 6100 - 6300 hp and if you dumb your gear with tank ring, that is even bigger dps loss than using ilvl 130 spell speed chest/belt instead 120 det/crit ones.

T13 is beatable in almost full i110. Full i120 is more than enough HP.

[Crevox]

Why are you guys so worried about MP, like, come on...

I clear T10-T13 as Summoner, every week. I am top DPS on every turn, every week, except for T13 which a Monk beats me on (as they should). Not to mention, I still have to wear a couple pieces simply for the vitality on this turn.

Why are you trying to say that we need buffs? My gear isn't even that good. Item level 122, no Dreadwyrm book, and my other raid members are much better geared. Yet, you still insist that Summoner needs buffs?

I'm very confused. The whole forum is making this out like Summoner is just dead, unplayable, have to switch jobs in coil because they can't handle it. Yet, I am doing just fine. Pulled 463 DPS on T13 last week. That certainly doesn't seem bad. No, I don't have any piety on my gear. No, you shouldn't be using piety, not even on your relic weapon.

Oh well, I guess. If you want to somehow convince SE we need buffs for no reason, go ahead. I'll just be here, playing Summoner, having fun with the job.

[Sunako]

T13 is beatable in almost full i110. Full i120 is more than enough HP.

I have left side full 120 but 130 hat and boots + 125 weapon and I still use tank ring for some extra hp my summoner T13 make our healers job little easier. Without tanking ring i would have 6077 hp with raid buff + black hq risotto. If something is possible do with minimal requirement, that does not mean you should do it in that way.

[Viridiana]

If something is possible do with minimal requirement, that does not mean you should do it in that way.

Granted, but saying that better gear than anyone had when it was first beaten isn't good enough gear just doesn't make much sense.

[Alkimi]

I clear T10-T13 as Summoner, every week. I am top DPS on every turn, every week, except for T13 which a Monk beats me on (as they should). Not to mention, I still have to wear a couple pieces simply for the vitality on this turn.

If you're less geared and top as SMN then your other DPS aren't at the same skill level as you. Melee DPS should be way ahead in 10-12, 13 less so due to Earth Shakers and all the opportunities for multi-dots.

Perhaps your BRD is only doing Foes and Ballad and leaving the melees with no TP, I dunno.

[Sunako]

No, you shouldn't be using piety, not even on your relic weapon..

Should I use spell speed my relic then if I do not wanna sink 10m + gil for the weapon that you are eventually gonna change for the Dreadwyrm book? Second choice would be accuracy, but hey, I can replace that accuracy with spell speed gear pieces so result would be same.

[Crevox]

Should I use spell speed my relic then if I do not wanna sink 10m + gil for the weapon that you are eventually gonna change for the Dreadwyrm book? Second choice would be accuracy, but hey, I can replace that accuracy with spell speed gear pieces so result would be same.

It depends on what content you're doing and how your gear is set up. More accuracy on your weapon easily allows you to adjust your other pieces and get more crit/det elsewhere, so it ends up being the same as taking your weapon to crit/det IV in many scenarios. I personally keep a gear set for every turn and finetune for minimum accuracy, and there are many scenarios where if I had just a few more accuracy points from somewhere (weapon!) I would be able to use other pieces of gear that would increase my DPS.

It can vary, but, I would say the accuracy is good if you're consistently running T9+. Otherwise, the accuracy is useless, and you should just dump it in spell speed. You can use the BIS solver on http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/ to easily finetune to a minimum accuracy if you adjust the weights to the current updated values, and in other situations as needed, check out the spreadsheet.

If you're less geared and top as SMN then your other DPS aren't at the same skill level as you.

Either way, if this truly is the case, it proves SMN can perform just fine in coil. I certainly do not believe SMN is the best DPS, and I don't believe that I shouldn't be out DPS'd by Monks, Dragoons, or whatever else, but I'm holding my own just fine, and doing quite well at that. It fits well in all the turns, the worst one of the four being T11 due to the large extended periods of DPS. However, the add phase is a good phase for SMN, so it's not all bad.

What is the complaint here? Why are people not liking/not playing SMN again?

Perhaps your BRD is only doing Foes and Ballad and leaving the melees with no TP, I dunno.

Some runs I don't have BRD, but when we do, he uses Foe and Paeon as needed. I also usually run with a BLM.

[mvenom]

Fcoil is doable as SMN but often times I think myself "This part would be 100x easier as blm". Just the MP part is annoying, having to rely on bard playing Ballad "for me", when I know as BLM he could be playing Foe's instead. Battle ress on paper looks nice, but as there are these mp issues, its not really ideal and SCH has supervirus as well, BLM would have eye for an eye, plus Apoc + Manawall + Manaward.

People complain because they saw DRG complain threads and buffs followed, they could do same for SMN in 2.5, we'll see. I've had thought of going BLM in 2.5 if they dont do anything to SMN, but still dont like the idea, since been SMN since open beta.