Eternal Bond - Standard Plan and Gold Plan

[Titor]

I'm not the one making outright claims as to what pay-to-win is. I said that winning is subjective, which it is. Therefore, pay-to-win can be applied to several facets of the game, whether you agree with it or not.

Getting a new mount? That's winning for a mount collector.
Getting a new minion? Same thing. It's winning for a minion collector.

Exactly this! What is the point of PvE anyway? You get new gears. New gears = new items. Do you really need those new items? No, no you do not.
But if obtaining those items and achievements are winning to you, why is not finding a RP partner who will marry you, getting your special chocobo and clothing not winning to someone who enjoys rp?

What is winning in this game anyway? That is defined by the player.

[MilesSaintboroguh]

Wait, you mean to tell me getting a mount or some other vanity item lets you win over....who? What's the conflict? Where's the contest? How do you "win" without those? Unless someone edited the dictionary when I was not looking, then no, no one is "winning" with cosmetic items.

[FireHero]

psssh...nothin personnel...kid...

sorry you have to pay me $20 for your smart remarks to bother me. So if you don't pay you don't win.

Wait, you mean to tell me getting a mount or some other vanity item lets you win over....who? What's the conflict? Where's the contest? How do you "win" without those? Unless someone edited the dictionary when I was not looking, then no, no one is "winning" with cosmetic items.

Yes am very confused to as a collector of these myself I would never count cash shop ones I mean how elitist to you have to be to get but hurt over this?

[Uielyave]

Winning as a term may be subjective, but usually within MMOs the "Pay To Win" as a term means being able to buy things that put you ahead of others in terms of competitive play. Such as if you were able to purchase (with real money) an amazing weapon that could increase your damage more than an item available in the game. In a sense, putting you forward on "Leader Boards" faster in actual competitive game play.

Winning as a term may be subjective, but usually within MMOs the "Pay To Win" as a term means being able to buy things that put you ahead of others in terms of competitive play. Such as if you were able to purchase (with real money) an amazing weapon that could increase your damage more than an item available in the game. In a sense, putting you forward on "Leader Boards" faster in actual competitive game play.

Obtaining an exclusive mount or mini pet that does nothing but appeal to aesthetics ..Its not really appealing to the widely accepted term of "Pay to Win". Being as there doesn't seem to be such a thing as "Pet and Mount collector's Leaderboards". Save for..maybe WoW where pet battling exists, but I haven't played it in a while.
Regardless, thing is, this is not ultimately affecting your gameplay as a whole.
I agree that if the Gold marriages somehow get better benefits later on, that may be a bit controversial. But I can't really see it as such right now. Also i doubt people with gold marriages get "first dibs". I think it's a first com first serve basis for scheduling.

[Amused]

sorry you have to pay me $20 for your smart remarks to bother me. So if you don't pay you don't win.

It was a joke.

[Titor]

Wait, you mean to tell me getting a mount or some other vanity item lets you win over....who? What's the conflict?

Win is not just about beating another person in conflict. Look at some of the lower definitions:
"manage to succeed or achieve something by effort.

manage to reach (a place) by effort."

The succeeding and achieving is I now have a mount.
The place I reached by effort is a mount.

It is winning by that definition?

If not, please define winning the game for me please? Is it just beating the latest PvE boss? In that case, everyone who already downed t13 can just leave there is no need for them to play anymore
(oh yeah unless they want all the gear for their class, items that are not necessary)
(Oh or farm primals for more mounts)
(or make some gil to buy vanity items)
(or roleplay and find an IC mate)
(or enjoy putting together a special look for their character)

[Amused]

Winning as a term may be subjective, but usually within MMOs the "Pay To Win" as a term means being able to buy things that put you ahead of others in terms of competitive play. Such as if you were able to purchase (with real money) an amazing weapon that could increase your damage more than an item available in the game. In a sense, putting you forward on "Leader Boards" faster in actual competitive game play.

It doesn't matter what it "usually" means. The reality of the situation is that there is no single absolute definition of "pay-to-win", but if we're going by the definition of the words used (which we should) pay-to-win DOES count when it comes to mounts, minions, or any other cosmetic item that is put into the cash shop.

The only acceptable things to charge real money for are things like server transfers, name changes, and appearance changes.

[FireHero]

It was a joke.

And your talking to me like am stupid good one.

[Uielyave]

Win is not just about beating another person in conflict. Look at some of the lower definitions:
"manage to succeed or achieve something by effort.

Im just curious. Would you have preferred a long drawn out quest that involved grinding or heavy battles wiht your spouse and only your spouse that would have perhaps taken an incredibly long time as well as large amounts of gil (perhaps housing prices) and expensive crafting items in order to achieve the mount and minion? This is a legitimate question because it seems like you're wanting something that'd take an immense amount of time and in game money that would, perhaps, effectively gate those who are unable to do those types of things in game.

And if this is not what you had in mind, give me an idea, perhaps? You want something free that gives everyone the exact same thing, but perhaps encourages people to just get married to themselves on separate accounts just to get the mounts / minions? That doesn't seem like something meaningful to me.

[Uielyave]

It doesn't matter what it "usually" means. The reality of the situation is that there is no single absolute definition of "pay-to-win", but if we're going by the definition of the words used (which we should) pay-to-win DOES count when it comes to mounts, minions, or any other cosmetic item that is put into the cash shop.

The only acceptable things to charge real money for are things like server transfers, name changes, and appearance changes.

By that definition, Name changes and Appearance changes shouldn't be either. because those would be considered "Strictly Cosmetic".