Remove both marriage plans.

[Abriael]

Even back then when they first started showing 2.0 screenshots they all featured the old battle system for almost a year

This is, as for most of the arguments I see from those against this, absolutely false.

[Tupsi]

This is, as for most of the arguments I see from those against this, absolutely false.

Most of the promotional screenshots including the 2.0 reveal was still showing and uitilizing the original 1.x battle system as stated by Yoshida and even anyone who seen it recogonized it off the bat. The "new elements" are what got people excited.



Notice the setup of skills and the fact it's not GCD? That's the original Battle system (1.2x era.) This was the first glimpse we seen of 2.0 concept or not.

The next Screenshot we seen was:



Note no GCD? Original 1.x system. It's ok to admit that things changed. 2.0 was only done because they couldn't fix core issues on the old engine..there was quite a bit promised that got thrown out or done vastly differently.

[Magis]

Most of the promotional screenshots including the 2.0 reveal was still showing and uitilizing the original 1.x battle system as stated by Yoshida and even anyone who seen it recogonized it off the bat. The "new elements" are what got people excited.



Notice the setup of skills and the fact it's not GCD? That's the original Battle system (1.2x era.) This was the first glimpse we seen of 2.0 concept or not.

The next Screenshot we seen was:



Note no GCD? Original 1.x system. It's ok to admit that things changed. 2.0 was only done because they couldn't fix core issues on the old engine..there was quite a bit promised that got thrown out or done vastly differently.

Are those timers on top of buffs/debuffs in the party window? That was a interesting idea.

[Abriael]

Note no GCD? Original 1.x system.

LOL. You don't define a battle system simply by the presence or lack of global cooldown. The screenshots shown no "battle system" per se. Which makes the statement above completely false.

[Tupsi]

LOL. You don't define a battle system simply by the presence or lack of global cooldown.

It's perfectly ok to admit that they were using the old battle system. As much as you want your side of the argument to be true, you actually do define the battle system by what the system actually does. Using your logic, the original beta-early 1.0 era battle system that used the Stamina/"3 slot" system is no different than what we have today or what we had during 1.2x era.

GCD was introduced for balancing and including scaling back TP from 3k to 1k and TP use being used differently with ARR's system versus 1.x's. You can't have skills costing 2-3k with a GCD and it still functions the same way it does today, that's a completely different battle setup. It's just a bit funny out of everything, you'd ignore the obvious.

And yeah, they originally wanted the timers to be shown in that fashion rather than what we got now but it likely wouldn't have worked.

[Roris]

The old battle system is in fact depicted in those screenshots, all down to the old ability icons used in them, the higher TP costs, the higher TP max and individual CDs. Hell the very first 2.0 screenshot shows the old TP building abilities before auto attacks were implemented. Sure, call them concept screenshots all you want, but they were in fact used to promote 2.0 when it needed the most promotion. The very first screenshot was especially used back when they announced they would be reinstating sub fees soon and that those fees would help fund 2.0. It was and still is, plain and simple, bait and switch and false advertising at its finest.

[Pibz]

Well this thread is still totally on topic

[Airget]

The old battle system is in fact depicted in those screenshots, all down to the old ability icons used in them, the higher TP costs, the higher TP max and individual CDs. Hell the very first 2.0 screenshot shows the old TP building abilities before auto attacks were implemented. Sure, call them concept screenshots all you want, but they were in fact used to promote 2.0 when it needed the most promotion. The very first screenshot was especially used back when they announced they would be reinstating sub fees soon and that those fees would help fund 2.0. It was and still is, plain and simple, bait and switch and false advertising at its finest.

I don't know how the convo switched to the battle system however I will add this. Those screenshots are not false advertisements. These are called mock-ups and their purpose was to serve how the game "could" look not how it would look. That screenshot above was posted October 2011 around that time when they pretty much just started on the project. The reason this mockup was used was to portray what they were working on and a visual of potential things to come.

As the process moved forward things change, they build the world, potentially they started the classes/jobs to have their current abilities and they tested the old battle system to see how it would feel in 2.0 and they felt it was a bit slow so they tried GCD. A game isn't straightforward as say I want to make this game where I will use concept A B and C, because as the creative process moves forward, balance is made and ideas come together you see what works and doesn't work and you alter the concepts of the game based on what you see works and doesn't work. That's what makes a good game, not something where once it's set in stone it can't be changed but a concept that as you progress through the changes and realize what works it doesn't work you adapt and recreate it to form a more cohesive experience.

And quite honestly if you want to be more accurate then just take a look at the pdf and go down to page 7 that shows that screenshot which you claim as a bait and switch http://wdl.square-enix.com/ffxiv/dow...Outline_EN.pdf

Because it notes in asterisks that it's still under development and when something is still under development it means things can change.

[Stihllodeing]

Well this thread is still totally on topic

So.....who's gonna place their bets on a 50% divorce rate six months from now? I'm gonna say 35% in two years. This community is pretty loyal

Anyway, seems like a silly thing to get worked up about. Cash shops are contemporary. Pay to win MMOs are easy to spot and taboo. Don't really think this is the topic for doom and gloom considering all the other things that could be fixed, but what do I know? Youth today has no idea how to focus that "world changing" energy man...in my opinion.

Sheesh.

[Roris]

I don't know how the convo switched to the battle system however I will add this. Those screenshots are not false advertisements. These are called mock-ups and their purpose was to serve how the game "could" look not how it would look. That screenshot above was posted October 2011 around that time when they pretty much just started on the project. The reason this mockup was used was to portray what they were working on and a visual of potential things to come.

As the process moved forward things change, they build the world, potentially they started the classes/jobs to have their current abilities and they tested the old battle system to see how it would feel in 2.0 and they felt it was a bit slow so they tried GCD. A game isn't straightforward as say I want to make this game where I will use concept A B and C, because as the creative process moves forward, balance is made and ideas come together you see what works and doesn't work and you alter the concepts of the game based on what you see works and doesn't work. That's what makes a good game, not something where once it's set in stone it can't be changed but a concept that as you progress through the changes and realize what works it doesn't work you adapt and recreate it to form a more cohesive experience.

That's fine and dandy when it's all mentioned in advance, however these big changes weren't publicized or discussed before being implemented. There was no mention at all that they would be looking into changing the battle system in any way post 1.23b, not even a slight hint, when all the other big changes coming in 2.0 were clearly stated or at least alluded to in both the first 2.0 PDFs and subsequent interviews and articles. Sure, some changes were expected and implied like a faster pace and a lack of lag thanks to the better engine and server infrastructure, which funnily enough it's still there, but not the entire 180 turn it did.

I get it, things and concepts evolve and change and also corporations don't owe anyone any explanations or justifications on their decisions, but they sure do get more respect when they do well in advance. Sure, Yoshida later posted a long justification on his changes to the battle system on the beta forums, but only after it was set in stone and he himself said all the feedback about it wouldn't be used because his new battle system concept was pretty much immutable.

The battle system argument came up because it's exactly what's been happening since back then, changes at the last minute without any sort of indication they were coming, after advertising certain features would be implemented differently for almost a year. Last minute exclusion of CT at launch, last minute changes to housing prices, last minute addition of a cash shop, last minute announcement of paid weddings, really there's not much trust left there.