DRK being compared to past FF games.

[BlaiseArath]

It's not that scarce. It's main ability is referenced in a lot of games as well.

And I do agree we are seeing the same facts differently, I just don't see much wrong with Dark Knights as tanks. They've even had Provoke, which really does nothing at all as a damage dealer, but is one of the few tank skills that really work like a tank in Final Fantasy.

Well we do agree on that, as I've expressed that I'm okay with DRK as a tanking class... I just feel like Dark Knight has been a "Risky attacker" in more games than it can be interpreted as a "tank" in.

why should we ? Remakes of the games added stuff that didn't exist previously considering the games sold in between. That doesn't mean the new version is more "authentic" or "valuable" than the old one.

I think the point is, inbetween each of these things, the classic Final Fantasy archeotypes evolve and become more unique as time goes on, so these new games/re-releases show those characteristics as to what Square Enix defines them as today. Thats how I see it, but that I can say is very open for interpretation. Its not to say the classic version should be ignored, but its worth noting that the newer version are equally valid when compared as evidence. Neither more important than the other. Dark Knight may not have began as the fierce risky HP-Sacrificing/Absorbing attacker we know it as today, but it has certainly involved into such and it shows in all the newer SE titles, peruse the Wiki yourself .

[Marxam]

Please bring back the 300% self heals SE /pray

[Mirron]

I point at Dimensions as a counter example. Pretty recent, and it has Provoke. It's also a very classic FF feeling. Yes, it has Darkness/Soul Eater (multiple levels of it in fact), but it still feels tanky. Just the way it feels is a tank that draws enmity by doing lots of damage.

And I honestly feel like the Darkness thing gets focused on too much. It may be the iconic ability of them, but it's not the only thing they do, and it's too risky to really use it consistently. If you have another tank Dark Knight is fine just laying on the damage, but when it's just the Dark Knight and a bunch of mages, it still works to keep them safe, like Cecil in IV.

[ErikMynhier]

The fact that its a tank helps me out because I love tanking and am going to love slipping on that sweat armor. Who care what was where and why. This isn't 2, 3, 4, 11, Tactics, Dimensions, or anything. This is Final Fantasy XIV, things gonna be the same, things gonna be different. DRK is a tank this time..... that's that. The end.

[Grey_Cain]

Personally, I'm betting that DRK in XIV will have a constant Drain Life/higher enmity buff (DRK version of Shield Oath), and a second buff that reduces its max HP for increased damage (DRK version of Sword Oath). Anything that cuts a chunk of its life for a high-damage attack is probably going to be a situational CD ability, rather than a GCD/combo attack that you're expected to use all the time.

And I honestly feel like the Darkness thing gets focused on too much. It may be the iconic ability of them, but it's not the only thing they do, and it's too risky to really use it consistently. If you have another tank Dark Knight is fine just laying on the damage, but when it's just the Dark Knight and a bunch of mages, it still works to keep them safe, like Cecil in IV.

Darkness isn't even that risky as in most games it only takes away 25-30% of your life and you're expected to have some way of generating consistent mass heals to recover it all every single round along with enough defenses to last through a few hits before those heals come along. Bravely Default has had the riskiest abilities by far with one Rage ability that uses the single-target 20% life loss attack 5 times in a row or until you're down to 1 HP, or just braving the 30% life loss for group-wide attack 3-4 times, but even that could be circumvented just by having the sword magic Drain on to recover all the damage as it's dealt.

[Urtear]

No one plays classes after level 30 anyway.

Ida know...I've seen a lvl 45 MRD in DD when healing a low level roulette once, and Titan norm had a 34 CNJ trying to heal. Gave me the anime 'dot-eyes' with the double blink.

[Fayto]

but PLD is specialized more in Healing, protecting, and defending, where as Dark Knight was more specialized offensively with black magic.

Actually it is fairly recent that Dark Knights even had access to Black Magic. In FFIII, they could even use White Magic while Cecil had no magic at all but amazing physical defense.

[Mirron]

Final Fantasy III Dark Knights aren't really Dark Knights in the traditional sense. It's more closer to them being simply Magic Knights, based off of the words used in the Japanese version.

And that's definitely not what I did with Cecil, Darkness just wasn't worth it typically except to speed up encounters. In X-2 it'd be kind of different, but in this game you definitely can't be shaving off 20% of your health with no concern. I imagine there will be a cooldown that's decently long or some other requirements to using it though, just a matter of finding out what.

[BlaiseArath]

Actually it is fairly recent that Dark Knights even had access to Black Magic. In FFIII, they could even use White Magic while Cecil had no magic at all but amazing physical defense.

I did allude to this, not in specifics I admit, but when I said, in not the same words "Dark Knight didn't become what we know it was today until later iterations of the game, and in remakes.", but it has been that way for a while. Black Magic actually isn't even fully a part of every Dark Knight in later games either, but with that said, the focus on offense is clear.

Final Fantasy III Dark Knights aren't really Dark Knights in the traditional sense. It's more closer to them being simply Magic Knights, based off of the words used in the Japanese version.

And that's definitely not what I did with Cecil, Darkness just wasn't worth it typically except to speed up encounters. In X-2 it'd be kind of different, but in this game you definitely can't be shaving off 20% of your health with no concern. I imagine there will be a cooldown that's decently long or some other requirements to using it though, just a matter of finding out what.

As far as Cecil goes, I imagine everyone plays offline FF games differently, I for one in Bravely Default enjoyed going full Thief for a part of the game for the lulz. I imagine not many other do.

But as far as its XIV iteration, Yah, in this game shaving 20% of your health might be a pretty bad idea, which is why I'm interested in seeing how they play it, and if its truly a Dark Knight or something entirely different.

[Mirron]

I'm sure it'll be a Dark Knight, unless your requirements for that are based solely on XI. And yeah, but it just didn't seem worth the resources to use Darkness consistently. Especially since so many characters in IV are very easy to kill. Outside of Kain and Yang, I think everyone who joins your team is basically easy to kill, making Cecil as the main solid person for most of the game.

And I could see up to 10%, but it depends on what exactly they are wanting it to do.